I agree to an extent about forcing people to wear lids.

But, if I were to ask you to explain in simple words what the mathematician exactly said and what his mathematical 'modeling' involved and whether you understand what he did, would you be able to?

No offence to you mind you, but I've written about people who, without understanding statistics or mathematics, or without even doing as much as reading the actual research paper, they are out to claim that they AGREE with the research they quote simply because the paper's view matches up exactly with their view. This fallacy is rampant.

You can read my article here : http://cozybeehive.blogspot.com/2009/03/statisculation-sporting-prejudice-in.html

I have to agree. I wear a lid every time I ride my bike, which is daily to work and on weekend when I mountain bike. However now and again I nip down to the butcher (lest than a mile) without my lid. I have the choice, however my 5 year old has no choice, I insist she wear her lid when ever we ride outside of our back yard. Hopefully it will become second nature and she will always wear it.

I don't agree with making it compulsary.

I do wear my mine most of the time, but I choose when and when not to.....yes on busy roads and off roading.....not always on my local cycle paths and canal path. I evaluate the risk duh! (yeah i'm really that smart!)

I don't agree that it would make many people stop cycling or not take up cycling in the first place, honestly? you might not be happy with it but you'd still cycle.

I'm sure the police would either get fed up stopping cyclists, have trouble catching some if they're not on the road, or just use their discression as they've got more pressing things to deal with. At least i'd like to think they would as they've still not caught the tw@ts that stole my mates laptop with all his pics of his trip backpacking around Thailand.

This is interesting discussion to watch as an Australian rider. Cozy Beehive I really like your point about the nature of research and how it's used, but more broadly, this argument is like being transported 20 years back in time for an Australian. I was an adult getting back into cycling when Australia was passing laws to make helmets compulsory and the arguments around it were exactly those which have been proffered here.

As a kid growing up in the BMX era I'd never worn a helmet and had had plenty of big bingles but no serious injuries and so I didn't really see the need but I could also see the sense in protecting myself against the 1% chance, especially since I was now doing road riding and felt the dangers were more significant. Now, like others, I feel naked without a helmet and my own kid is well into wearing hers. I get grumpy when I see older kids carrying their helmets but not wearing them (If they're gonna be hardcases why don't they go the whole hog and leave the helmet at home ?!)

To sum up, compulsory helmetage hasn't killed cycling or even stunted it, last year Australia sold more bikes than cars for the umpteenth year in a row. Sure, some people don't ride because they feel they look silly in a helmet or it will wreck their hair...but it's not many - as the numbers suggest. In some ways, because it's the law it gives people (especially kids) an easy reason to wear one.

As for the idea that making helemts compulsory will be a consequential burden on the NHS, I'd like to see how the numbers were calculated in terms of the health benefits from people being fitter and more active and the decreaed number of patients with brain injuries who have to be cared for by the NHS.

And Australian cops chasing helmetless kids down back roads ? No, they're mainly out looking for stolen laptops, too.

Scalpelist -

Do you tend to see many helmetless riders in Australia? What are the consequences if you're caught without one - a fine?

As you say, maybe the cops don't chase down everyone they see helmetless, but I'm presuming there must be some sort of effort at enforcement? From briefly reading the NS article, I can't see if helmet law enforcement costs have been included as a factor in the equation, which would surely be a big consideration if you're 'costing up' whether to make a compulsory helmet law or not...

I'm with everyone else here. I don't think we should be made to wear helmets. I do wear mine usually if I'm going out for a ride, but I do love warm summer days, where it's nice to go back to being the old skool roadie and leaving the head naked. If I'm on the mountain bike, I always wear my helmet, aggressive XC is stupid without it.

Choose for yourself, but good to see people getting the kids to be safe...

I always where a helmet, but then I can identify at least 3 occasions when I would have been dead without one.

But I agree it is matter for each individual to 'evaluate the risk duh! (yeah i'm really that smart!)'. If they are not smart enough then the mechanisms of natural selection kicks in.

Cheers Chubbos,

No, I don't see many riding without helmets, certainly not people out in bunches or even on bike trails/'family ride' situations. The main group of helmetless types are teenagers but it isn't universal among them, I think the 'industry' effort to portray pro/sponsored riders as always wearing helmets has had a positive effect - lots of kids wear lids at skate parks.

In terms of police response, not wearing a helmet can lead to a warning and/or a fine, I'm not sure how much it is. My suspicion is that it is not very often enforced - I've never seen a cop car stopped besdie a helmetless rider and cop writing a ticket....

When the laws were being brought in in Aus we had visions of police spending all their time on enforcing the law, racking up fines against ten year olds while anarchy reigned across the country, but I think what's really happened is that common sense prevailed, police used their discretion, the law 'encouraged' the law-abiding types to do the right thing (as 95% of society always will) and the police had something to use against 14 year old vandals if they couldn't get anything else to stick (just a random thought, not a lot of evidence behind it). Ultimately, I think the possibility of a fine was the most important part of the legislation's aim to reach it's target, everyone knew police were busy enough already

I take everyone's point about the individual's right to choose, I felt the same way myself, but don't you find it interesting that we all feel good about making sure our kids are protected from a head injury ?

In short, I reckon that if it is made compulsory in the UK (And I was surprised to learn it wasn't already) the world won't end but a few kids might have their brains protected until they're old enough to work out the value of a helmet for themselves.

I was riding through my town centre (on the *painted* cyclepath that runs through the pedestrianised centre), and a pedestrian that had been walking in the same direction decided to suddenly turn 90deg left, into my path and go all rabbit-like as I skidded into her.

I split my left eye when I head-butted her (mostly caused by my MTB glasses focusing the load across my eyebrow), still have the scar from it, and the pic in my 10yr passport was taken shortly after, so it will be some time before I forget!

I had massive bruises up the insides of both legs, where I hit my own forx. And a massive bruise in the middle of my sternum from where my stem hit me.

There was apparently not a scratch on her.

If I'd been wearing my lid, with it's nice sun-visor peak, I'd still have had the bruises. It's likely I would have escaped the split eye. But, I reckon I would have scalped her.

"I always where a helmet, but then I can identify at least 3 occasions when I would have been dead without one."

Complete and total hyperbole ! No one can possibly identify when they could have died but actually did not.

Except maybe Dr Who.

Anyway, we make our own judgement call. Mine is this: 25 years, 75000 miles and never once banged my head whilst riding a bike. But as for cupboard doors, undersides of tables, car boot lids, flying bottles at a gig, falling masonry, violent drunks looking for a punch up... mind your head is my advice.

Dear Cycling Plus,

Thank you very much for some balanced reporting on mandatory helmet wearing in the latest magazine. Over the last 10 months or so I had a feeling that, through contributions on your letter pages, you were subtly yet persistently pursuing helmet promotion, softening the resistance to helmet wearing and, intentionally or not, gradually paving the way to complusion.

I would like to repeat my thoughts on the effectiveness of helmets which I sent to you in July last year in response to several articles in your magazine and on the web. Even a year after my crash I still feel the benefit of helmets can be overstimated (and the benefits of tiny safety clips on mudguard stays underestimated).

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Here's what I wrote to you last year:

The recent case of Kirsten Murphy who crashed on her helmeted head but then broke her neck (http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/display.var.2400000.0.0.php?utag=23754) resulted in an “a helmet saved my life” message. Since I crashed similarly, although probably with higher speed, on my bare head 6 months ago I thought I shared my experiences with the Cycling Plus readers. The cause of my crash was, as I found after some searching, a “catastrophic mudguard failure” while I was cycling over a hatched area with plenty of debris (a stone becomes jammed between mudguard and tyre, described here. http://www.ctc.org.uk/DesktopDefault.aspx?TabID=3803 - Mudguard safety – 1997.11).

The front wheel jammed so quickly I was unable to take the hands off the brake hoods. I knew I was doomed. Like a sailor walking the plank, hands tied behind the back and heading into the water, I went over the handlebars and hit the tarmac, head first with my bike following behind.

I was not unconscious and I knew straight away that at the very least I split my head in half. At A&E they found to my great surprise that I only had two cuts, bleeding heavily, but so minor still, by A&E standards, that they only needed “gluing” instead of stitching. My upper body felt for 3 days like that of a cartoon character, head between the shoulders.

I have been extremely lucky and would like to think that a helmet might have done some good, however poor Kirsten’s case makes me unsure, assuming that potentially the helmet gives little protection but produces load transference to the next weakest element in the chain …the neck.

No doubt had I been wearing a helmet, even though I might have broken my neck, this would have been another “a helmet saved my life” story, strongly promoted and defended by myself.

live and let live? thats how i think about it....

I have been riding bikes for nigh on 20 years now, starting as a kid on my BMX and working my way through the various stages of cycling. As most kids back in the 70's i never had a helmet and had some serious crashes even knocking myself out once. Its a life lesson and all part of learning, sometimes you need to find these things out for yourself so in future you can make a more educated risk assessment.

i have been living in London for many years, and I have ridden my bike to work every day for the last 4 years and never wore a helmet. but as soon as i think about a serious road ride or some mountain bike action the first thing i grab is my helmet.

In the end I personally dont think it should be compulsary or legalised. Adults have the right to choose, but as a good parent its your duty to protect your children and also to educate them. To be honest growing up in australia with the helmet laws, the laws dont mean much to a kid, but the ads on TV and in the papers to educate kids was much more effective.

In the end by making all these laws to protect and censor people are we making them less aware of the dangers later in life when those of us who have experienced these things arent there to guide them.

I hate wearing a helmet and depending on what route I'm doing I sometimes wont. I just evaluate the risk. This morning for example was a route I've done a thousand times and I know what bits are quick and what are slow and I just take a bit more care on the quicker bits.

Also, it has to be said I see alot of people not wearing helmets properly so sort of pointless wearing them in the first place!

Having been in the police for 14yrs I have sen many accidents involving cyclists.

It is clear from what I have seen that those wearing helmets certainly did a lot a protect their heads, Granted the rest of their body still gets a beating. When you see the damage, first hand a helmet recieves and the minimal if any damage the head of the wearer recieves, you certainly get a truer perception of the advantages.

Statistics are a waste of time reading, they say whatever the writer wants them to say.

Whilst I agree primarily it is up to the individual and being forced to wear would put peoples back ups, we in britain had the same adversions to wearing seatbelts, and although many still fail to wear them, those that do, see the benefits, including myself, when an £$&^hole attempted a three car overtake on blind bend in the dark. It hurt but I probably would have been dead if it wasnt for my seatbelt. But I digress

Do you think any of those people not wearing their helmets when hit by a car or inaminate object, actually thought that would happen when they set off on their ride. No. They were probably thinking Ive done 75000 miles without one, why bother.

The more serious riders seen by have to riders to be wearinghelmets the better the message and safer we all will be.

I have also heard reports of insurance companies adjusting their payouts based on wether the cyclist was wearing a helmet and the expected difference in injury severity.

No offence meant to anyone but plaese wear your helmet.

What gives people the cheek to tell others how they should live? Governments should stop interfering with individuals and their right to make their own decisions. One of the most common injuries in work is a paper cut - should we ban paper, make people wear gloves or look for other control measures to reduce risk.

Who hasn't fallen off? Why is it that those who have fallen off wearing a helmet swear that their lives have been saved by their foresight in protecting themselves? I have had three major crashes; one back decorated by road rash, one pair of cracked ribs and one badly bruised hip bone. What a pity I wasn't wearing a helmet, I might have been saved!!!!

Risk is part of learning by experience. Takea away risk and we either stop learning about what we are capable of or, if the proponents of the Risk Compensation Theory are right, we put ourselves into more and more dangers possibly beyond our capabilities. Then we crash!!!!!

On that basis we should ban all safety devices in case they encourage us to seek out more and more risk. I'm sure there are statistics that could prove this argument ( Munich taxi driver experiment is a start).

Wear a helmet if you want but please leave me and others like me alone.

In some accidents a helmet isn't going to do much but in some it will save your life.

Personally I'll wear a helmet but I never used to, so what right do I or anyone else have to tell anyone to wear a helmet.

If you're going to wear a helmet buy a good quality one that fits & wear it correctly but if you don't want to wear one good luck that's your decision.

I really think it would be a step backwards to make helmets compulsory.

I'd rather road safety people cracked down on motorists holding phones rather than persecute cyclists. Still far too many morons out there who cant work hands free kits. I'd ban them for a year straight off.

"I always where a helmet, but then I can identify at least 3 occasions when I would have been dead without one."

"I always where a helmet, but then I can identify at least 3 occasions when I would have been dead without one."

Crap - I meant to say - if I was as bad a rider as the guy who posted that one I think I'd wear a helmet too.

TBH, only proper cyclists have the brains to wear lids. POsers deserve to die!!! :)

as a fireman i have to deal with the idiots who dont wear a seatbelt and there is always someone who justifys not wearing it because they know someone who got trapped, died etc because they wore a seatbelt.

i suppose wearing a helmet is the same someone will always come up with a case for not wearing it ie energy transfer, but 99.9% of the time a lid will have a beneficial effect as if you going fast and hard enough to brake your neck then i think your going to get hurt regardless lol

i was unfortunate to hit a young girl who ran out in front of me quite some years ago. i was in my car doing 30mph and didnt have time to hit the brakes as she ran out of her garden playing with friends. her head bounced off the windscreen smashing it, then she bounced down the road like a ragdoll as the energy and speed from the car was transferred to her body. she was a mess and spent some time in intensive care and had to be revived numerous times.

it was just pure luck she had been playing on her bike and hadnt taken her lid off.her parents showed me her helmet and i can only describe it as a boiled egg that had been bashed. there is no doubt whatsoever that with out a lid she would of died instantly

oh one final thought, would you go on a motorbike without a lid ?

my 10p worth

oh something else regarding making them a legal requirement , anyone remember when seatbelts came out ?

I would have thought the safety of the rider is his/her choice

I can't understand why people are so frightened of death they try to stop people living.

Cycling helmets is only the tip of the iceberg and general health and safety costs the country billions of extra pounds just because the system see's risk as a bad thing

If people can’t be trusted to make their own decisions then what’s next, should I kill my kids to stop them from coming to any halm

your born and you die that is the only rule to life, the rest is up to you, and should stay that way

Some people chose to live their lives wrapped up in cotton wool and others chose to push the boundaries, this is the way it is !!

If i chose not to wear a helmet and stick my head into something hard it should be my choice!!

Now if my wearing a helmet could stop me from hurting others during an accident I could see why I should where one

I have never worn a helmet I have had many and accident on and off road and not once has my head got involved

Weather you see it as stupid or not it should still be MY CHOICE!!!!

you say its your choice and to a point i agree but......using the seatbelt as an example again. when we ( emergency services ) have to deal with a scalped face or mullered body because they've been through the windscreen is it fair we have to do this when a seatbelt would of just left a little bruising ? is it fair on the family who have to deal with the consequences ?

I dont care must for politics or trivia

I just think that all risk, as long as it does not put anyone else at risk should be up to the person

I hate to be the one to point this out, but everyone on this forum agrees that children should wear helmets. If that is the concensus then it is just ridiculous to insist on not wearing one yourself. The only reason this is an issue for you is because it was not compulsory all along.

My advice - everyone should get over themselves and admit that if they want their kids to wear helmets it is because somewhere deep down they know it is safer. What is safer for kids is safer for adults and making it law can help to prevent injuries.

The same issue came up when bike helmets became compulsory and look at everyone now.

When I got back into cycling, I wasn't too fussed on wearing a helmet - but then my kids started to ride, and same as everbody else, made sure they wore helmets. I then started to make sure I always wore my helmet 'to set the right example', and now feel naked without it.

Still look like a prick though. Must buy any colour other than purple next time lol :-)

I personally think it's irresponsible not to wear a helmet when cycling. Ending-up in a wheel chair or worse would rip the lives of my family to bits.

COOL KIDS WEAR LIDS!

Hi to all out there(helmets or not!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)The subject of to wear or not to wear is in itself VERY,VERY subjective.In my younger days of training to be the short arse JUDO CHAMP' we were told and shown in very graphic ways that the head is the heaviest part of you body;in proportion to all other parts.Get the head on the move and the rest will almost certainly follow.The obvious exception is if you are on the move feet first,in which case it trails and flails!.This situation is THE CONKER on the thread,however I personally believe that if statistics were available for those with serious or fatal injuries from not wearing helmets against those that did the resulst might well show nothing conclusive enough to enforce their usage.I believe it is, and for a long time to come going to be a personal choice;for a great many reasons.The one thing a helmet will never prevent is some idiot that needs a trip to specsavers from giving you an assisted take off and causing a broken neck & death from that.HOWEVER the one thing that should be ENFORCED is the HIGH VIS CYCLE SHIRT/JERSEY.Short sleeved for summer and long sleeved for when it's needed.The HIGH VIS GREEN & HIGH VIS YELLOW are unmissable,and any one that collides with a cyclist because the did not see you!!?? or tried to scim your arms with their mirrors to avoid slowing up and waiting should be taken off the road there and then.They should be then subject to a RE-TEST of everthing,THE EYES in PARTICULAR and a wopping increase in their insurance premium and have a new driving permit issued clearly stating the situation,not some gobble-dee-gook bar code.The helmet can be like an illfitting bike,in itself a potential hazard,causing you to fiddle,loose concentration and balance and on fall off;breaking your neck and not having anyone to blame but yourself with a foofnote on your headstone.GET THE BASICS RIGHT,BE SEEN,LOUD & PROUD.Happy & safe riding to you all.