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Ph!l_GeeWhizz
Joined: 06 Nov 2009
Posts: 9
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 Posted Sat Nov 7, 2009 10:09 pm |
Evening all. First post so go easy 
Basically been into biking for around 20 years but the past 5 years ive done very little. Just getting back into it, still riding my 20 year old bike (with a few upgrades) and am really enjoying it. Finding it hard to do as much as i want to what with work, dark nights and family, but when i'm out its great.
What i'm really interested in is the nutrition side of things but find it hard to afford all the special foods and supplements that are purpose made for the job. I stretch to using "Go" bars and also the SIS PSP22 powder which do seem to make a difference. What i'm after really is maybe some reference material to read in order to work out a realistic diet that will help with riding as i would ideally like to get into competing next year. I find recovery after a ride is probably me weakest point.
If anyone can point me in the right direction it would be greatly appriciated.
Phil .
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jibberjim
Joined: 04 Dec 2008
Posts: 310
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Posted Sat Nov 7, 2009 10:56 pm |
You can make your own versions of the sports food, buying in bulk and cheaply from My Protein, see my site on sports nutrition for recipes.
However, there's really very little difference between sports food and just good general food, it's a fair bit more convenient to just have powders, but it's not a whole lot better outside of actual competition when you're right at the limit of what you can digest.
Jibbering Sports Stuff: http://jibbering.com/sports/ |
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Tenkfeet
Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 28
Location: Glasgow
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Posted Sat Nov 7, 2009 11:10 pm |
Food for Fitness by Anita Bean is a good read .
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Bhima
Joined: 07 Nov 2008
Posts: 1449
Location: Manchester
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 12:19 am |
This will let you search for foods high/low in whatever you specify:
http://www.mealographer.com/food.php?action=search
You can use that to help you find "real" food which would replicate the effects of the expensive suppliments/powders/etc.
There's lots of stuff to learn, although these are the basics:
If it's recovery you're struggling with, you need to get protein ASAP - ideally 30-50g and another 40g at some other points in the day. Also, about 100g-150g of sugars/fast carbs after a ride will refuel you quickly, so your muscles are ready for the next ride. For me, it's a natural yoghurt/milk/banana/honey mix in the blender. 
Hydration is essential. You sweat quicker than you can replace your fluids, so you're fighting a losing battle. The best thing you can do is drink constantly, every 5 minutes or so. Adding a pinch of salt to your drinks will help hydration.
When riding, slow-release starchy carbs will give you fuel for a longer period, like porridge. Fast carbs, like sweets/carb drinks give you a quick boost for a hard effort, which doesn't last very long. I combine both with honey sandwiches. Fat and protein slows down digestion.
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Ph!l_GeeWhizz
Joined: 06 Nov 2009
Posts: 9
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 2:07 pm |
Mmmm! Honey sandwiches!! Clear or set honey though?
Thanks for the info, guess i got a bit of reading to do.....
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keef66
Joined: 29 Apr 2008
Posts: 1042
Location: Noomarket, deepest Suffolk
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Posted Mon Nov 9, 2009 2:19 pm |
I don't think you need to spend money on the expensive "sports nutrition" stuff. (unless of course you want to) I tried the assorted ZipVit goodies with the free waterbottle, and found them all pretty disgusting.
Just eat a normal, healthy diet. Get plenty of protein and complex carbs, fresh fruit and veg, cut down on fats and refined sugars. Stay well hydrated. Get enough sleep, and include rest and recovery days in your training
On the bike I take fig rolls (=energy bars) and jelly babies (=gels), and fill my bottle with squash or watered down fruit juice (with a pinch of salt in the summer)
Summer recovery drink milk / yoghurt / banana / honey milkshake. In winter it's a pint of sweet tea and a couple of Hobnobs.
I don't race though.
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Headhuunter
Joined: 28 Nov 2008
Posts: 1334
Location: SE London
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Posted Mon Nov 9, 2009 4:30 pm |
I think nutrition depends on the extent and intensity of your rides. If you're 20-30 mile rides at pootle pace you can probably get by on "standard" food like honey sandwiches and orange squash etc, however if you're doing high pace club rides of 50+ miles with plenty of hills, your body will probably need something more substantial. Sports drinks use maltodextrin rather than standard sugars/glucose/fructose etc which are less bio available.
I have been experimenting by buying raw ingredients from My Protein, I mix maltodextrin, electrolyte salts, choline and sometimes some protein powder (your body will start to burn protein as well as carbs if you push it hard and fast, if you don't consume protein, it will burn muscle). I used to try to do fast club rides of 50 or 60 miles on water, bananas and a couple of breakfast cereal bars and at the end would be completely wiped out. These days with proper sports drinks I can go further, faster and when I get home I am not finished for the day!
My only love sprung from my only hate!
Too early seen unknown, and known too late!
Prodigious birth of love it is to me
That I must love a loathèd enemy |
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Ph!l_GeeWhizz
Joined: 06 Nov 2009
Posts: 9
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Posted Tue Nov 10, 2009 9:33 pm |
This is where i get lost with all the different terms and things you should have. If and when i do take it to the next level, then i'll probably start using them.
For now, my target is to get fit and do either the coast to coast ride or newcastle to edinburgh next year. Having the carbs and fluids and trying to get the protein in after a ride. Definately feel its helping as i can ride harder and recover quicker.
Dont get me wrong, i'm only doing 5-15 mile rides through the week but am seriously unfit.
Really enjoying it though!
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Bhima
Joined: 07 Nov 2008
Posts: 1449
Location: Manchester
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Posted Tue Nov 10, 2009 10:29 pm |
Don't overanalyze everything - just make sure you keep up the hydration and food while riding. It doesn't have to be anything fancy, as long as it's got enough carbs and low fat. Energy powders/gels can be replaced by honey and energy bars can be replaced by sandwiches/fruit/flapjacks.
If you don't sort out the food/drink while riding, your muscles will be in more pain at the end of the ride, compared to if you'd been keeping on top of things. You are therefore already losing when it comes to recovery because you've been falling behind with your "debt repayments". The last 30 minutes of my rides are usually easy spinning while I drink 750ml and eat a sandwich.
How much you need on the ride will depend on how hard you're going. If you feel hungry/thirsty, the general rule is that you should have eaten/drunk something about 20 minutes ago. It's too late.
On an average 5 hour ride, I get by on cheese/nutella/honey sandwiches (about 5 in total), a couple of bananas and between 4-7 litres of fluids. You can survive on much less if you're trying to lose weight or aren't going too hard. Just keeping a constant flow of fluids and energy moving through your body should be the number one priority. It doesn't really matter what you eat/drink, it's more about how and when you eat/drink.
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Escargot
Joined: 04 May 2009
Posts: 294
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Posted Wed Nov 11, 2009 8:33 am |
| Bhima wrote: | | You can use that to help you find "real" food which would replicate the effects of the expensive suppliments/powders/etc. |
LOL.
And there was me thinking that supplements were replicating the food I was eating
I'm sure you meant that the other way round but I fear this is how things are going with supplements i.e. people thinking they are more nutritious than normal food 
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mrc1
Joined: 21 Apr 2009
Posts: 31
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Garry H
Joined: 14 May 2008
Posts: 353
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Posted Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:57 pm |
9, if he's using 750ml bottles 
Assume he makes use of shops, the generosity of nearby households and streams though...
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a_n_t
Joined: 21 Nov 2007
Posts: 1273
Location: Manchester
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oldwelshman
Joined: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 2415
Location: United Kingdom
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Posted Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:10 pm |
| Bhima wrote: | Don't overanalyze everything - just make sure you keep up the hydration and food while riding. It doesn't have to be anything fancy, as long as it's got enough carbs and low fat. Energy powders/gels can be replaced by honey and energy bars can be replaced by sandwiches/fruit/flapjacks.
If you don't sort out the food/drink while riding, your muscles will be in more pain at the end of the ride, compared to if you'd been keeping on top of things. You are therefore already losing when it comes to recovery because you've been falling behind with your "debt repayments". The last 30 minutes of my rides are usually easy spinning while I drink 750ml and eat a sandwich.
How much you need on the ride will depend on how hard you're going. If you feel hungry/thirsty, the general rule is that you should have eaten/drunk something about 20 minutes ago. It's too late.
On an average 5 hour ride, I get by on cheese/nutella/honey sandwiches (about 5 in total), a couple of bananas and between 4-7 litres of fluids. You can survive on much less if you're trying to lose weight or aren't going too hard. Just keeping a constant flow of fluids and energy moving through your body should be the number one priority. It doesn't really matter what you eat/drink, it's more about how and when you eat/drink. |
7 Litres? !!! I would have to stop for a pixxss every 10 miles if I drank that much.
In winter I get by with 1 750ml bottle for about 50 to 60 miles and top it up on cafe stop.
Even in summer I use only 2.
http://s290.photobucket.com/albums/ll245/oldwelshman/ |
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Bhima
Joined: 07 Nov 2008
Posts: 1449
Location: Manchester
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jibberjim
Joined: 04 Dec 2008
Posts: 310
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Posted Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:55 pm |
| Bhima wrote: | | If you think 7 litres is loads, some riders in a grand tour stage go through 15 in 4 hours! |
That includes the very large amounts they pour over themselves to assist in cooling. it is not what they drink in an easy ride around the north of england in the autumn.
Jibbering Sports Stuff: http://jibbering.com/sports/ |
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Bhima
Joined: 07 Nov 2008
Posts: 1449
Location: Manchester
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Posted Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:00 pm |
No, it's definately what they drink. I've heard this figure quoted from several different sources. According to the Cervelo Test Team's nutritionist, 12 L was normal during the Giro.
Seasons have nothing to do with it. I wear more layers in the cold, so my body temperature gets just as hot as the summer.
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Lazarus
Joined: 15 Dec 2002
Posts: 1208
Location: Acme land
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Posted Wed Nov 11, 2009 6:21 pm |
| a_n_t wrote: | | Bhima wrote: | | Don't overanalyze everything |
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Wish i was on earlier i would have loved to have posted that beauty 
Gratz Ant
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Ph!l_GeeWhizz
Joined: 06 Nov 2009
Posts: 9
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Posted Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:04 pm |
I aint riding serious enough for that amount of fluids but do know what you mean about keeping hydrated.
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oldwelshman
Joined: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 2415
Location: United Kingdom
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