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teagar
Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 1449
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 Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 3:15 pm |
| pottssteve wrote: | | pedylan wrote: | | Frank the tank wrote: | | dmclite wrote: | Please wear a poppy. Forget politicians lies, the incompetence of government. Respect the squaddies on the ground, doing the job, it means a lot to soldiers that people wear a poppy.
A small symbol of massive respect and honour. |
Well said that man. |
I think he's got previous: directly relevant previous.
There really shouldn't be any debate about displaying respect for people who give their lives in conflicts and in arenas not of their choosing. Whether we should have a military presence in Iraq or Afghanistan might be debateable but that has no relevance in recognising the death and injuries sustained by the forces sent there.
And when we're on the subject the poppy and the Help for Heroes symbols shouldn't be appropriated to demonstrate patriotism by odious chancers. |
Well said, that person. I have to go down to Central HK to get them - I make sure I do every year. |
For me the disupute isn't showing respect to soldiers. Sure they get my respect.
The dispute is that it seems to me that the poppy symbolises respect for people who have died for a British cause, rather than, people who have died in war, period.
Since I'm not comfortable with that distinction, I choose not to wear one.
Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie. |
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johnfinch
Joined: 07 Oct 2008
Posts: 1095
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 3:39 pm |
| teagar wrote: |
For me the disupute isn't showing respect to soldiers. Sure they get my respect.
The dispute is that it seems to me that the poppy symbolises respect for people who have died for a British cause, rather than, people who have died in war, period.
Since I'm not comfortable with that distinction, I choose not to wear one. |
What about the white poppy?
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teagar
Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 1449
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 3:48 pm |
| johnfinch wrote: | | teagar wrote: |
For me the disupute isn't showing respect to soldiers. Sure they get my respect.
The dispute is that it seems to me that the poppy symbolises respect for people who have died for a British cause, rather than, people who have died in war, period.
Since I'm not comfortable with that distinction, I choose not to wear one. |
What about the white poppy? |
I thought that was something to do with the church?
Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie. |
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softlad
Joined: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 1525
Location: Ceredigion
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 4:12 pm |
| teagar wrote: |
For me the disupute isn't showing respect to soldiers. Sure they get my respect.
The dispute is that it seems to me that the poppy symbolises respect for people who have died for a British cause, rather than, people who have died in war, period.
Since I'm not comfortable with that distinction, I choose not to wear one. |
two reasons to wear it:
1 - to show respect for those who have died in the service of their country. In another time, that could equally have been your or I.
2 - to raise money for the injured from those conflicts - many of whom are still suffering decades after.
Which of those two reasons are you not comfortable with..?
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zippypablo
Joined: 01 Oct 2008
Posts: 61
Location: Yorkshire
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 4:22 pm |
I resent having to buy a poppy to support these soldiers. Governments past and present have no problem sending them to war but have a problem looking after them when they return. That said, i still buy more than one every year (keep losing them)..
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johnfinch
Joined: 07 Oct 2008
Posts: 1095
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 4:36 pm |
| teagar wrote: |
What about the white poppy? |
I thought that was something to do with the church?[/quote]
No. The idea came from the peace movement.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Poppy
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gabriel959
Joined: 04 Aug 2008
Posts: 1024
Location: Cambridge, UK
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 4:51 pm |
I don't wear one but respect anyone that does.
I don't believe in war and its the decision of those poor kids to go to Afghanistan or Iraq for that matter. Long time ago, when WWI and WWII it was a different kettle of fish as those weren't volunteers (on the whole), they were picked.
The government should support the injured / families anyway.
x-x-x-x-x-x-x-x
Giant SCR 2 - FCN 2
Sabbath Silk Road - FCN 2
Doing something for charity! |
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iainment
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
Posts: 683
Location: The Kingdom - Kerry
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 5:07 pm |
| softlad wrote: | | teagar wrote: |
For me the disupute isn't showing respect to soldiers. Sure they get my respect.
The dispute is that it seems to me that the poppy symbolises respect for people who have died for a British cause, rather than, people who have died in war, period.
Since I'm not comfortable with that distinction, I choose not to wear one. |
two reasons to wear it:
1 - to show respect for those who have died in the service of their country. In another time, that could equally have been your or I.
2 - to raise money for the injured from those conflicts - many of whom are still suffering decades after.
Which of those two reasons are you not comfortable with..? |
I don't buy or wear a poppy.
I give to other charities on a regular basis.
Like others on here I don't see why the public have to cough up , it should be the state paying any and all costs for soldiers injured in politicians wars. If there was a readily available white poppy I probably would buy that though.
That doesn't mean that I disrespect anyone.
Pip pip.
Old hippies don't die, they just lie low until the laughter stops and their time comes round again.
Joseph Gallivan |
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softlad
Joined: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 1525
Location: Ceredigion
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 5:20 pm |
maybe I shouldn't have mentioned the second reason, as clearly there are some here with short arms and deep pockets. Surely remembrance is reason enough..?
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brownleather
Joined: 03 Nov 2009
Posts: 107
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 5:24 pm |
| teagar wrote: | | The dispute is that it seems to me that the poppy symbolises respect for people who have died for a British cause, rather than, people who have died in war, period. |
Remembrance Day is about remembering everyone who died what ever their nationality. Of course the Royal British Legion all about supporting our veterans, other countries have their own systems.
| gabriel959 wrote: | | I don't believe in war and its the decision of those poor kids to go to Afghanistan or Iraq for that matter. |
Rubbish.
Not everyone comes from backgrounds that mean they are able to pick and choose careers, and are often left with the choice of a sh!tty down and out job or even crime or joining the forces where they can make a respectable life for themselves. People join to defend their country not fight in these wars, they know they might have to go Iraq/Afghanistan, but that's not their decision.
| iainment wrote: |
I don't buy or wear a poppy.
I give to other charities on a regular basis.
Like others on here I don't see why the public have to cough up , it should be the state paying any and all costs for soldiers injured in politicians wars. If there was a readily available white poppy I probably would buy that though.
That doesn't mean that I disrespect anyone.
Pip pip. |
You give to other charities? The government should cough up for those charities to. Sounds like disrespect to me. Veterans have earned their rights to have a charitable organisation in their name, as they fought, suffered and died for our rights. Most other charities are no where near as deserving in my opinion.
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teagar
Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 1449
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 5:33 pm |
| softlad wrote: | | teagar wrote: |
For me the disupute isn't showing respect to soldiers. Sure they get my respect.
The dispute is that it seems to me that the poppy symbolises respect for people who have died for a British cause, rather than, people who have died in war, period.
Since I'm not comfortable with that distinction, I choose not to wear one. |
two reasons to wear it:
1 - to show respect for those who have died in the service of their country. In another time, that could equally have been your or I.
2 - to raise money for the injured from those conflicts - many of whom are still suffering decades after.
Which of those two reasons are you not comfortable with..? |
I thought that was summed up in my previous post.
I don't like the idea that the money only goes to UK soldiers.
The poppy is a symbol of British sacrifices, because of the poppy fields that grew between UK and German trenches etc.
Given that I don't particularly identify myself as being British, I think that's reasonable!
Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie. |
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brownleather
Joined: 03 Nov 2009
Posts: 107
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 5:38 pm |
| teagar wrote: | The poppy is a symbol of British sacrifices, because of the poppy fields that grew between UK and German trenches etc.
Given that I don't particularly identify myself as being British, I think that's reasonable! |
As I've just said, Remembrance day is about remembering EVERYONE who died. But it is right that the RBL support our Vets, other countries can look after their own financially.
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teagar
Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 1449
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 5:41 pm |
| johnfinch wrote: | | teagar wrote: |
For me the disupute isn't showing respect to soldiers. Sure they get my respect.
The dispute is that it seems to me that the poppy symbolises respect for people who have died for a British cause, rather than, people who have died in war, period.
Since I'm not comfortable with that distinction, I choose not to wear one. |
What about the white poppy? |
Seems to draw plenty of unecessary attention, since there's debate about it. There are "opponants" of white poppies according to wiki.
I'll just keep doing my own thing, not sh!t on any soldiers who return for war and allow anyone else to respect and remember who they want.
Note: the above post is an opinion and not fact. It might be a lie. |
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pabloweaver
Joined: 03 Nov 2004
Posts: 327
Location: far enough north & not enough south
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 5:43 pm |
you wear a poppy to acknowledge the fact you can have the liberty to come on here and argue about it ...
it has nothing to do with the rights and wrongs of goverments but the lives and losses of generations.
the politics are irrelevant , the dead are not .
Celtic fans take note.
Ned Flanders: "You were cycling two abreast?"
Homer Simpson: "I wish. ....We were cycling to a lake." |
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softlad
Joined: 24 Jul 2008
Posts: 1525
Location: Ceredigion
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 5:44 pm |
| teagar wrote: |
Given that I don't particularly identify myself as being British, I think that's reasonable! |
I didn't realise you were not British. As a matter of interest, how is remembrance conducted in your own particular country of origin...?
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northstar
Joined: 03 Jun 2009
Posts: 121
Location: Surrey
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 5:59 pm |
| softlad wrote: | | teagar wrote: |
For me the disupute isn't showing respect to soldiers. Sure they get my respect.
The dispute is that it seems to me that the poppy symbolises respect for people who have died for a British cause, rather than, people who have died in war, period.
Since I'm not comfortable with that distinction, I choose not to wear one. |
two reasons to wear it:
1 - to show respect for those who have died in the service of their country. In another time, that could equally have been your or I.
2 - to raise money for the injured from those conflicts - many of whom are still suffering decades after.
Which of those two reasons are you not comfortable with..? |
Why should he have to wear it?
You can still respect people in your own quiet way without feeling the need to put it on show.
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teagar
Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Posts: 1449
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brownleather
Joined: 03 Nov 2009
Posts: 107
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 6:02 pm |
teagar
Having read your posts about your dissertation in racism, you sound like the sort of PC Brigade that like being politicians, and like to send our troops off to die. No disrespect like, but politicians are generally scum.
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whyamihereLost
Joined: 05 Apr 2003
Posts: 18260
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 6:08 pm |
I don't wear one. Never have done.
I stick money in the box every year, but refuse the actual poppy. The only charity symbol I wear is a LiveStrong band, and that's more because it tends to be a cycling symbol rather than displaying that I've given to the charity.
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pabloweaver
Joined: 03 Nov 2004
Posts: 327
Location: far enough north & not enough south
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Posted Sun Nov 8, 2009 6:24 pm |
| whyamihere wrote: | I don't wear one. Never have done.
I stick money in the box every year, but refuse the actual poppy. The only charity symbol I wear is a LiveStrong band, and that's more because it tends to be a cycling symbol rather than displaying that I've given to the charity. |
I see more non cyclists wearing them than cyclists.....
I repeat ...politics are irrelevant , the dead are not.
Ned Flanders: "You were cycling two abreast?"
Homer Simpson: "I wish. ....We were cycling to a lake." |
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