Bike build query

Sorting out your thrunge brackets, fettling your inter-rositers and even stuff about bike parts.
Corners R Us
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Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Mon Jan 14, 2013 18:39 pm

So in a moment of eBay madness I ended up purchasing a clean 16" 2009 Carerra Vulcan Disc Only frame for £30 + some P&P as below!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2009-Carrera- ... true&rt=nc

The intent is to transfer as many parts across from my ageing and now quite tatty Saracen Tufftrax and only buy new where required. I appreciate the Vulcans not a racing whippet or the trendiest of brands but it suits my needs for winter trail riding perfectly. And at that money whats not to like!

So Q1. Does it have a semi integrated or integrated headset? I think OE spec is an FSA of some description. I already know that my old (and tired!) FSA Pig cupped headset wont work on the large headtube on this frame. Some guidance on how to identify what I need to buy would be much appreciated. I presume this style of headtube/headset will still accept my recently purchased 1 1/8 steerer Rock Shox XC30 forks?

Q2. I've already worked out my front LX mech is top pull and this frame is bottom pull. Equally I'd be pretty luck if the tube diameters matched so I'm gonna need a front mech. I'm running 8-speed at the back with triple rings on the front. Looking through Chain Reactions site 8 speeders are getting scarce. Can I run a 9 speed specific mech; presume not? I notice Sram do a reasonably cheap 8 speed which can do top or bottom pull applications and also comes with shims for different tube sizes - neat! Shimano optiosn appear to be limited to whats available and not discontinued!

I've also worked out that I can get a USE shim kit to get the right fit for my USE suspension seat post to work so thats a relief.

Looks like the frame comes with a bottom bracket although it doesn't say so in the description. Fingers x'd it'll be reasonably smooth and can remain in situa a while longer.

Q3. If not how do I decide what I need? 68 or 73 and axle length 110 113 122?! How do I decide what to buy!! I'm still running old school square taper BB and have just bought a new FSA crankset for the old Saracen when the rings on my XT chainset finally cried enough!

Any pointers appreciated from the more technically aware than I! I've got a decent tool kit and bike stand and have built a fair few bikes but some time ago now so some of the more modern techs a bit new to me!!! I've been poring over Which Mountain Biek for the past few months and its all a bit confusing and awe inspiring at times........

Hopefully it won't be too costly or painful to build and will be ready for the Hell of the North Cotswolds with a few test rides beforehand!!

Cheers, Corners

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nicklouse
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Re: Bike build query

Postby nicklouse » Mon Jan 14, 2013 18:55 pm

Q1 read the standards on Parktools and measure the frame. it might be a semi integrated/internal headset.
Q2. LX could be dual pull and multi tube size with spacers. more info needed.
Q3 measure the frame. and then id what cranks are going on and what chain line you want and look up the axel length you need.

or ask here giving all the info.

bookmark the Parktools webby
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Corners R Us
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Mon Jan 14, 2013 19:01 pm

Whilst I own several Park Tool I'd not come across the web site before; what an informative place! More research required and thanks for the pointer.

Corners

Corners R Us
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Mon Jan 14, 2013 19:48 pm

So I e-mailed the seller to see if he could point me in the direction of what headset....and he's got one for it and will supply it FoC; result! There's also a BB still in the frame so I really only need to get a shim for my seatpost possibly and resolve the front mech issue potentially!

I love it when a plan comes together!

My longer term plan is to buy a good full sus frame, something like this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/140905644090? ... 1423.l2649 and build something unique over time with the Vulcan mutant as a winter hack.

Corners

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The Rookie
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Re: Bike build query

Postby The Rookie » Mon Jan 14, 2013 20:37 pm

Headset is semi integrated, frame will take a high or low mount 31.8mm clamp bottom pull front mech, mine has run both.

Seatpost is 27.2mm and the clamp 31.8mm.

BB shell is 68mm.

9speed mechas work fine with 8 speed shifters, in fact 8/9 speed are almost totally interchageable other than cassette, chain and shifter, although occasionally frongt mechs can play up.

Check link in my sig to what you can do with a Carrera hardtail frame and join us on the hardtail thread when it's done!

Any other Q's and I'm very familiar with that frame so feel free to PM me.

Neal_
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Neal_ » Mon Jan 14, 2013 21:14 pm

What Beginner said.

The front mech that came on mine had a high clamp but the XT (9 speed) replacement was a low clamp as I wasn't sure if the high clamp version would work with the bottle cage bolts.

The head tube internal diameter is 44mm top and bottom and the normal cups are semi integrated (zero stack) although the lower cup can be external so you can use a tapered fork and also increases the axle to crown height which will make the head angle slacker. See below for these options.

http://superstar.tibolts.co.uk/product_ ... cts_id=114

http://superstar.tibolts.co.uk/product_ ... cts_id=539

Seatpost shims http://superstar.tibolts.co.uk/product_ ... cts_id=306

My square taper bottom bracket was a Shimano UN55 68 x 113 although I think the second number is crank specific.


I've replaced most of the parts on mine over the years and have just got a nice new frame so will be sticking all the old parts on the Vulcan to use as a hack.

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The Rookie
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Re: Bike build query

Postby The Rookie » Mon Jan 14, 2013 21:26 pm

Frame will take 100 or 120mm forks, but if you use tapered you're limited to 100mm, personally I would stick with plain 120mm forks unless you want an XC bike in which case 100mm.

Corners R Us
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Tue Jan 15, 2013 18:04 pm

Many thanks for the informative responses. I'll certain post some pics up once built up and join the Carerra group!!

Cheers, Corners

Corners R Us
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:55 pm

Frame arrived today in one piece. Looks good and reasonably light with headset, BB and seat clamp fitted. Doesn't look likes its had much use. I have one minor concern in that the rear mech hanger looks a bit bent and has a small nick/witness mark on it suggesting it might have had an impact at some point that could have bent it. I'll know more once I get a rear mech, chain and wheel in there and if they run fine then it might just be my over critical eye!

I presume I can get a replacement via Halfords or somewhere online? I'll have a look later when I have more time.

Pics of build to follow.

Corners

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mrmonkfinger
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Re: Bike build query

Postby mrmonkfinger » Thu Jan 17, 2013 14:00 pm

Mech hanger is £8 at halfords, IIRC.

I had to get one for my Kraken, they're the same hanger.*


* I think.

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The Rookie
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Re: Bike build query

Postby The Rookie » Thu Jan 17, 2013 14:21 pm

They are the same, and it's £7.99.....less if you get discount! ;-)

Corners R Us
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Thu Jan 17, 2013 14:29 pm

Frame is 2009 year. Presume they're the same design/hanger?

This the badger:

http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stor ... yId_165455

£7.99; result! The entry level of mtb'ings not to be sniffed at looking at the price of some hangers for more gucci level frames!!!!

Corners R Us
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Sun Jan 20, 2013 21:04 pm

So in amongst all the various weekends fun and games I managed to get a new rear mech hanger; the one on it was bent to buggery and sneak an hour in the garage this pm and I've got a rolling shell with forks, wheels, chainset, rear mech seat/seatpin and bars and stems all fitted.

First result was that my USE suspension seatpin is 27.2 so fits; yipee! It can serve me some more!

Because the integrated headset everything sits lower/flush to frame so I'll need to cut the stearer down about 1"+ as I have about 10 stem stackers and it looks stoopid! I also need to get the bike on the floor. Sit on it and set the seat and bar height and go from there. Sods law will probably dictate that the star nut in the steers exactly where I want to cut but we'll see!

The headsets very slack too and there's lots of play in it? The frame came with the bearing cartridges installed and a ring for the lower fork crown and a single upper metal ring with a rubber seal that fits snuggly on the 1 1/8th steerer tube. I presume thats all I should have? I think I need to get it on the floor and snug everything down with weight on it rather than than trying to do it on the bike stand as it never seems to work trying to fit headsets that way.

So I have a short shopping list I think. A front mech, possibly some outer cable although I think I'll have enough of that kicking about in various boxes. Oh and a star nut. Think I used the last one I had fitting the forks to my other frame!

I'll post some pics later if I get time. If someone could confirm that have the right amount of headset components I'd appreciate it.

Cheers, Corners
Last edited by Corners R Us on Mon Jan 21, 2013 18:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Corners R Us
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Sun Jan 20, 2013 21:20 pm

The frame ready and waiting!

Image

New rear hanger; shame its not black but beggars can't be chooser!!

Image

The donor bike awaits its fate!

Image

The USE suspension seatpin lives to fight another day!!

Image

A rolling chassis after 60 mins of allen key and spanner twirling!

Image

My aim is to be up and running for a first ride next Saturday or Sunday.........

Corners

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The Rookie
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Re: Bike build query

Postby The Rookie » Mon Jan 21, 2013 08:38 am

You need a crown race on the fork, yes the stock one comes with a thin rubber 'seal', from memroy it sits on top of the crown race not under it, then you need the centering ring from above, the top cap and then your spacers and steerer.

Use a 1/2" drive extension bar to knock the SFN down the fork before cutting, do it carefully and it will stay square.

Looking good, lets see it in the Carrera Hardtails thread! I presume the read chain will carry over to the red frame!

Fopr info the 2009 frame is the same as 2004/5 (not sure which) through 2011, and is made by Merida.

Corners R Us
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Mon Jan 21, 2013 18:12 pm

I'll go take some pictures later to ensure I have everything I need! Sounds like I have.

To re-cap I removed the FSA lower crown ring from forks and replaced with one supplied with frame. Slid steerer tube up head tube. Lower crown race seems to fit snug in bottom of headtube. Put top race/centering ring with rubber seal onto steerer tube and slid down steerer (snug fit to steerer tube) covering cartridge, then stem spacers, stem and then top cap as normal. Tightening the top cap should then tighten up forks in head tube correct?

Yes the red chain will be staying. Its only about 50-miles old! Probably revert to normal colour chin idc as the red finish doesn't last!

I realised I also have Mega 9 front and rear LX mechs on my Saracen...running 8 speed cassette and shifters...so I'd answered one of my questions above already!! Doh. I'm annoyed at myself as I recenly bought some new 8-speed shifters and an 8-speed cassette....when I could have gone 9-speed...finally!!!

I'd not thought about driving the star nut deeper then cutting off - good tip that man! As you say gently does and thats another £1.95 saved!

It'll appear in the Carerra thread when done don't worry!

Cheers, Corners
Last edited by Corners R Us on Wed Jan 23, 2013 22:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Corners R Us
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Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 20:41 pm

Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Mon Jan 21, 2013 18:37 pm

So a few pics to ensure I have all the bits to make my headset work properly and I'm not missing something!

Image

Lower crown/race as supplied and fitted. No rubber seal?

Image

Upper race/centring ring with rubber seal. You can see the gap between the steerer and bearings that I presume this centres/negates?

Image

All present and correct? I seem to have managed to get it a bit tighter just fiddling about with it to take pictures. I imagine the 10 stem stackers weren't helping in my first mock up fit!!

Corners

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The Rookie
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Re: Bike build query

Postby The Rookie » Mon Jan 21, 2013 21:22 pm

Somtimes it 'wedges' up and then free's off and is loose, always spin it back and forth after doing up the headbolt for the first time to make sure it has settled. I also find it useful to do it up 'a bit too tight' (not stupidly so) to make sure everything has settled as far as it's likely to go.

Corners R Us
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Corners R Us » Wed Jan 23, 2013 22:30 pm

Nearly done! I had an hour or so free this evening when my son's football training was cancelled due to snow so I turned on the heater in the garage and got to work! Amazing what you can do in an hour!

First job was stripe down the forks and cut the steerer to length. Thanks Beginner for the tip about driving the star nut deeper; worked a treat and I didn't hacksaw it in half! Job completed without issue and once I put everything together and tightened up the top cap it all snugged down beautifully with no slop or free play. Just need to disassemble and apply some Teflon grease and thats that jobbed.

Image

Ordered a new bottom pull 31.8 Deore LX Mega9 front mech from Chain Reaction on Tuesday morning at 930hrs and it arrived today at 1100hrs; top quality service indeed and all for £9.99!

Image

Next I applied the bling red chain, chainstay protector and bottle cage and pump!

Image

Tadahhhhhh! Almost done. Just need to get a new rear brake cable (Avid mechanical calipers), re-fit all brake and gear lines, re-fit my front shock lock out cable, adjust the gears and brakes, apply the front Crud guard and I should be good for a ride at the weekend. First impressions are that its very similarly proportioned to my outgoing Tufftrax frame. Its smidge heavier but the Saracen was 6061 tubing. The Vulcan has more rear tyre clearance so I have the option to go up from the 2.2 Evil Twin I have on. In overall terms I'm well chuffed given what little money I've outlayed to replace an ageing frame! I might try loosing some weight with some lighter tyres, bar/stem combo and tricker parts as and when things wear out or I spot them going cheap on eBay! Hmmm 1x10 might be the next thing......

Image

Anyways thanks again to all who've provided useful input and pointers for this build. Hopefully I might see you on the trails some day to say thanks in person! I'll post a pic in the Carerra thread once completed.

Corners

Deputy Dawg
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Re: Bike build query

Postby Deputy Dawg » Wed Jan 23, 2013 23:53 pm

Looking good.

The forks go so much nicer with that frame than the old one. ;)
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