Must have old features back

An area to discuss the use of and any issues with using http://www.bikely.com/ and the BikeRadar Routes
Carbonfiberboy
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2011 17:28 pm

Must have old features back

Postby Carbonfiberboy » Sat Nov 26, 2011 18:34 pm

I see the beta site has gone live without our ability to comment or test a fully functional beta site. Some beta! Doesn't do much for developer cred.

Must have the Start/Stop drawing button back. Site is unusable without it, as it constantly generates new route additions when all we want to do is pan.

Also echo jimmy99's comments:
viewtopic.php?f=40054&t=12807968#p17318140
Especially the ability to edit routes! We need to be able to see where the intermediate points are, delete them sequentially, and then add new points midway between points. That's all been taken away from us. That's not an improvement. That's how we revised routes and we need that functionality back! Without this functionality we have to enter entirely new routes instead of revising and some of our routes are hundreds of miles long and take hours to enter. We really liked the old draw and navigate menu system. Let's have something like that back. In fact, I don't see anything that is an improvement, only reduced functionality.

While we appreciate the site being up, we used bikely because of specific functionality. We can't use it until that functionality is restored. Many members of the two bike clubs I belong to used bikely to draw and publish routes and now, except for using the old routes which are in our databases, that's pretty much over.

Also, pretty weird that our bikely login doesn't work on the forum now and we need to create a new, identical login to post here.

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josnor
Lead Developer
Posts: 206
Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 08:48 am

Re: Must have old features back

Postby josnor » Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:27 pm

Must have the Start/Stop drawing button back. Site is unusable without it, as it constantly generates new route additions when all we want to do is pan.

If you just drag on the map to pan around it shouldn't add a new link - it certainly doesn't for me. What browser are you using?

We need to be able to see where the intermediate points are, delete them sequentially, and then add new points midway between points. That's all been taken away from us. That's not an improvement. That's how we revised routes and we need that functionality back!

You can still edit routes - take a look at our FAQs on inserting and deleting points and moving existing points

Carbonfiberboy
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2011 17:28 pm

Re: Must have old features back

Postby Carbonfiberboy » Fri Dec 02, 2011 16:00 pm

josnor - wrong. That's works for the green points that the user inserted themselves. It does not work for the zillion point which follow-the-road inserts between the green points. Those are not shown on the map, they are very difficult to find because they are not shown, and they must be found and deleted individually. On the old bikely, every point was shown if one hovered over it, and then points were deleted serially simply by clicking delete. You might try that with both versions. You'll see what I mean immediately.

The other thing one must do to modify a route, after deleting a section, is to insert new points. Your new version makes that impossible, also. The old version inserted new points midway between any points already defined, be they major or intermediate. Then one dragged them to their new position on the route. This was quite easy to do. The new version does not do that.

Dragging the major points to a new location doesn't do it. It just makes the problem worse, by now providing a route to and from the point's new position, but not moving the original route at all. Now you have a zillion more wrong points which you also can't find and delete.

It is, essentaily, now impossible to modify a route. Much quicker to start from scratch. The old version was very good. This new version is simply unusable.

I used to be a developer and I know very well how this works. The developer wants to have pretty code and a pretty result. The end user is ignored.

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josnor
Lead Developer
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Re: Must have old features back

Postby josnor » Fri Dec 02, 2011 16:15 pm

I used to be a developer and I know very well how this works. The developer wants to have pretty code and a pretty result. The end user is ignored.

That's not our intention at all. We felt that the old interface for editing routes was cumbersome and the new interface would make it easier. For old routes where the points haven't been annotated with a description then it does make it a little harder because, as you say, you can't see all the little auto-generated points. However, if you want to edit a section I suggest you add three new points to the route (see my response to the next quote below): one where you want to start the edit segment, one where you want to finish and then one in the middle which you can drag to the new position.

The other thing one must do to modify a route, after deleting a section, is to insert new points. Your new version makes that impossible, also. The old version inserted new points midway between any points already defined, be they major or intermediate. Then one dragged them to their new position on the route. This was quite easy to do. The new version does not do that.

You can easily add new points to the route by hovering over the route and clicking on the green point which appears - see the guides I linked to above.

Dragging the major points to a new location doesn't do it. It just makes the problem worse, by now providing a route to and from the point's new position, but not moving the original route at all. Now you have a zillion more wrong points which you also can't find and delete.

I'm not sure about this. I think you actually might be describing a bug. Would you mind taking before and after screenshots for me please, and describing what you did?

Carbonfiberboy
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2011 17:28 pm

Re: Must have old features back

Postby Carbonfiberboy » Sat Dec 03, 2011 06:58 am

OK. Let's get into the beta more completely.

So since there aren't any cookies, when I go "Create Route/Draw", I get a map of the world. If I attempt to "go to my location" (city, state abbreviation) the beta just flat hangs. So I close the tab and restart. This works in Google Earth. I suppose it's supposed to work in bikely. And why hang the software with the little wait circle? I gave it several minutes, no resolution.

In my new tab, I hit "Draw route" again and zero in on my start town. Ooops, I went away and forgot what I was doing. I hit Draw Route again and - bang - I'm back out at the world again and have to repeat my zeroing in on the target city. No excuse for that. It should remember where I was.

So I create a short route, try to save, and get a "Route cannot be saved" message. Period. No error message. Bikely is working fine, otherwise. I can bring up it up in another tab and edit the route I was drawing, but it won't even save a route. Ah, I figured it out. I took a meal break from the computer and when I came back, it had logged me out with no notice. So when I tried to save a route, it wouldn't save. Nor would it tell me why. I finally got it to save a test route.

So then, since you asked, I thought I'd show you how it screws up trying to edit a route, so I moved a couple of points and tried to save the route under a different name. I get "Route cannot be saved" again. No explanation. This is quickly becoming non-confidence inspiring.

I'm running Chrome on a Win7 64 bit system. Chrome is always up to date and so is my system. Chrome worked fine on the old bikely. In spite of the warning message, it always saved fine when bikely was up.

So if you can get it working well enough to save routes, I can show the how it screws up moving a point in totally random ways. If we can get that fixed, then we could talk about how to get it back to where we could edit routes, too.

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josnor
Lead Developer
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Re: Must have old features back

Postby josnor » Mon Dec 05, 2011 09:32 am

Carbonfiberboy wrote:If I attempt to "go to my location" (city, state abbreviation) the beta just flat hangs. So I close the tab and restart. This works in Google Earth. I suppose it's supposed to work in bikely. And why hang the software with the little wait circle? I gave it several minutes, no resolution.

This feature relies on you giving your browser permission to send your location to us; you should get a bar at the top of the page in Chrome where you can do this when you click on the 'Go to my location' button.

So I create a short route, try to save, and get a "Route cannot be saved" message. Period. No error message.

Have you ever been able to save a new/edited route in the new version of Bikely? Are you accessing it from your home computer? Do you know if you're behind a proxy server?

Carbonfiberboy
Posts: 94
Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2011 17:28 pm

Re: Must have old features back

Postby Carbonfiberboy » Mon Dec 05, 2011 16:43 pm

Clicking "go to my location" hangs the tab solid with the little circle. Entering my location and clicking "go" is working today. AFAIK CHROME sends my location. I don't do anything to prevent it. Looking at Tools, I can't find a setting that either allows or prevents same.

Yes, I can both create and save edited short new routes. However my old long routes do not save when edited. Here is an example of a route I would like to edit, but cannot:
http://www.bikely.com/maps/bike-path/Bl ... t-Big-Rock

1) because it does not save,
2) because moving points causes spurious results
3) because there are no tools in the new version that will allow me to remove intermediate points sequentially like in the old version

I would give you point numbers, so you could move the same points I'm moving, but of course I cannot because point numbers are no longer visible in the new bikely. So try moving points at 40.05 km., given as kilometers because in spite of my default being miles, the new bikely ignores me. Move one of those points (I can't tell you which one, as stated before) to the end of Mountain View Rd. NE.

BTW, this discussion may be moot. I see that the other ride leaders in my club (10,000 club members) have quit using bikely and are now creating databases with another cycling mapping product which generates cue sheets and is working fine. They're gone. Going live with an untested, unusable product was apparently the last straw.

jamesptrk5
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2007 23:54 pm

Re: Must have old features back

Postby jamesptrk5 » Fri Dec 16, 2011 00:20 am

Ditto. I already logged in on Bikely, so why force me to repeat? Why are all my old rides now reported in KM, despite my having set my preference to miles? Where can I find this setting to correct it back again? Why do all my links to my old rides fail now? Still have a ways to go, eh?

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josnor
Lead Developer
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Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2010 08:48 am

Re: Must have old features back

Postby josnor » Tue Dec 20, 2011 09:37 am

jamesptrk5 wrote:Ditto. I already logged in on Bikely, so why force me to repeat?

What do you mean?
Why are all my old rides now reported in KM, despite my having set my preference to miles? Where can I find this setting to correct it back again?

There currently is no setting, you just choose on the fly. We're working on making the site remember which you chose.
Why do all my links to my old rides fail now?

Got any examples?


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