Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

The place for more serious off topic questions, light hearted banter and friendly chat.
User avatar
random man
Posts: 1578
Joined: Mon May 31, 2010 18:56 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby random man » Mon Oct 01, 2012 16:00 pm

Pross wrote:Assuming there is truth in this I can understand the victims of this sort of thing keeping quiet and then mentioning it after the person has died. However, the one woman on saw on TV was working for the BBC at the time and claims to have walked in and witnessed one of the occassions. If this is the case why has it taken her until after Saville's death to mention this? Surely she had a duty to raise it at the time rather than after his death and in not speaking up she possibly contributed to him being able to continue his behaviour. Instead she appears to have decided to keep quiet rather than risk her career but now that nothing can be done has decided to speak openly in public.

I certainly wouldn't defend JS in this and it does appear there is a large amount of corroboration between the statements of the alleged victims but why has everyone waited until after his death to make this a public matter? Not only can he not defend himself if innocent but he can't be punished if guilty.


It's all speculation at the moment, but maybe this woman did raise the issue and it was all covered up. We don't know.

User avatar
Pross
Posts: 15204
Joined: Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:32 am

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Pross » Mon Oct 01, 2012 16:10 pm

It'll be interesting to hear what she says in the full interview but from the limited clips I have seen she doesn't suggest that she raised the issue. If she did and the BBC ignored her then we have a potentially very big story.

mybreakfastconsisted
Posts: 990
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2010 18:01 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby mybreakfastconsisted » Mon Oct 01, 2012 18:02 pm

The girls were from a school for wayward young people, exactly the sort of troubled teen targeted by a predatory paedophile because their word would not be believed. Bravely, these girls DID report what had happened, and were punished for it:


The testimonies of the women that appear in the Savile documentary are heartbreaking. One spoke of how she was raped by Savile, but that she blamed herself because "no one blamed him." Another was locked in an isolation unit for days at her approved school when she made allegations about Savile in the 1970s, because she was assumed to be lying, as are so many abused children both then and now.


"No one believed me then and I don't expect anyone to believe me now."

Unless we start listening to children, in decades to come we will be hearing the same tragic stories.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ocumentary

User avatar
Ben6899
Posts: 4921
Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2009 19:49 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Ben6899 » Mon Oct 01, 2012 18:54 pm

From the BBC article...

But fellow broadcaster Paul Gambaccini said he had been "waiting 30 years" for such stories to come out.

Speaking on ITV1's Daybreak programme, he said newspapers had been primed to run similar stories while Sir Jimmy was alive, but the star had intervened to prevent their publication.

"On [one] occasion, and this cuts to the chase of the whole matter, he was called and he said 'well you could run that story, but if you do there goes the funds that come in to Stoke Mandeville - do you want to be responsible for the drying up of the charity donations'. And they backed down."


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-19788721

We all know how reliable newspapers are as a trustworthy source.
Ben

Bikes: Starley JKS R1 | Gios Megalite | Dolan Preffisio | Giant Bowery '76
Islington CC: http://www.islington.cc

User avatar
Alinshearah
Posts: 325
Joined: Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:09 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Alinshearah » Mon Oct 01, 2012 19:02 pm

I feel sorry for Frankie Boyle, who is crossing out "Michael Jackson" and scribbling in "Jimmy Saville" in all of his paedophile jokes.

rodgers73
Posts: 2202
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2010 15:05 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby rodgers73 » Mon Oct 01, 2012 19:06 pm

Yes, I suspect that aggressive threats of litigation stopped Saville's (alleged) abuse being revealed while he was alive, as it did with Robert Maxwell's misdeeds while he was alive, only for everyone in Fleet Street and beyond trying to distance themselves from him the day after he died.

As well as that, there is the question of his age. I would expect his sex drive and so his desire to abuse/rape children will have faded in his later life. This may have been one of those instances where it was "all in the past" and there was perhaps not so much urgency in revealing what he had done as all it would do was put the victims through more trauma and not actually prevent any further abuse.

User avatar
Smokin Joe
Posts: 5658
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 21:14 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Smokin Joe » Mon Oct 01, 2012 21:44 pm

rodgers73 wrote:Yes, I suspect that aggressive threats of litigation stopped Saville's (alleged) abuse being revealed while he was alive, as it did with Robert Maxwell's misdeeds while he was alive,


For a newspaper to accuse someone with the financial clout of JS of having sex with under age girls they would have to be very certain of their facts, and the people making the allegations would have to be able to provide proof. Losing a libel case is very costly.

mamba80
Posts: 2415
Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2009 13:06 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby mamba80 » Tue Oct 02, 2012 08:06 am

The Police investigated these allegations in 2007 and the CPS found insufficient evidence.

Regardless, unless you ve first hand knowledge of this type of thing, you have no idea of the power an abuser has over you, even decades later and after their death - and a famous figure like JS (or a family friend) even more so.

A close family member was abused by such a person and 37yrs later and 32 years after their death, he eventually told all, none of us had a clue - the shame and feelings of guilt had never left him, even blaming himself for the abusers death! (of a heart attack)
So dont belittle these womens allegations, we will probably never know the truth, they ll be no trial, no defense and no closure.

User avatar
OffTheBackAdam
Posts: 2007
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 16:34 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby OffTheBackAdam » Tue Oct 02, 2012 08:12 am

An unmarried bloke, in the showbiz arena, who loved his mother, the only surprise here is that it was young girls he was attracted to!

Tom Butcher
Posts: 7046
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2003 22:07 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Tom Butcher » Tue Oct 02, 2012 09:42 am

Well the rumours go way beyond young girls don't they.
------------------------
it's a hard life if you don't weaken.

dylanfernley
Posts: 400
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 20:29 pm
Contact:

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby dylanfernley » Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:09 am

Tom Butcher wrote:Well the rumours go way beyond young girls don't they.


you can say what you like now-- he's dead, was it anything 'warm' ?

Tom Butcher
Posts: 7046
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2003 22:07 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Tom Butcher » Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:32 am

The stories about late night visits to Leeds morgue, procuring young kids for other well known figures - who knows - I'm sure a year ago people would have said the stuff that's come out in the press already was nonsense. It is a shame he's dead because I think a lot of victims would have gained some kind of closure from a full investigation - but part of me thinks that there wasn't really a desire to investigate him - if Newsnight could get 10 people to testify against him for their piece which was never broadcast (why?) seems odd that the police/CPS couldn't get enough to get it to court.
------------------------

it's a hard life if you don't weaken.

User avatar
GiantMike
Posts: 3162
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 09:41 am

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby GiantMike » Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:39 am

Tom Butcher wrote:if Newsnight could get 10 people to testify against him for their piece which was never broadcast (why?) seems odd that the police/CPS couldn't get enough to get it to court.


Because to go to court you need a proper case and proper evidence. To make a TV prog about a dead person who can't sue, you don't need any evidence at all.
my power improvement experiment blog

Rule number 100: It's your bike and your money and your time; do what you like with it and ignore other peoples' rules. Except this one.

Tom Butcher
Posts: 7046
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2003 22:07 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Tom Butcher » Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:55 am

Are witness statements not proper evidence ?

edit - the evidence seems fairly overwhelming that he was guilty of at least some of the rumoured activity.

The rumours have been pretty well known for many years. I just think that a proper police investigation would almost certainly have found enough evidence to satisfy the normal requirements of the CPS. Yes there are conspiracy theorists about just about everything but in this case it's hard to believe that there wasn't at least a blind eye turned to his actions by people who could have stopped it - including people within the police.
------------------------

it's a hard life if you don't weaken.

User avatar
GiantMike
Posts: 3162
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 09:41 am

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby GiantMike » Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:33 am

Tom Butcher wrote:Are witness statements not proper evidence ?


Yes, they are proper evidence that somebody is claiming that something happened. They're not necessarily accurate or robust when under scrutiny of a lawyer. If I told the Police I'd been abducted by Victoria Pendleton it would be a witness statement, but an unreliable one that the CPS would not act on.
my power improvement experiment blog

Rule number 100: It's your bike and your money and your time; do what you like with it and ignore other peoples' rules. Except this one.

Tom Butcher
Posts: 7046
Joined: Sun Feb 09, 2003 22:07 pm

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Tom Butcher » Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:52 am

Yes one possibility is that they conducted a full and thorough investigation and the evidence presented wasn't strong enough to bring a case - unfortunately we all know that the police do not have an unblemished record and it seems far more likely to me just given what is in the public domain that there wasn't enough done to bring him to justice.
------------------------

it's a hard life if you don't weaken.

Heavymental
Posts: 4647
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 09:01 am

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Heavymental » Tue Oct 02, 2012 17:44 pm

In hindsight it was a bit like having Herbert the Pervert from Family Guy on our screens without ever wondering if he was dodgy.

User avatar
GiantMike
Posts: 3162
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 09:41 am

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby GiantMike » Tue Oct 02, 2012 17:51 pm

I haven't had the opportunity of seeing all the conclusive evidence that Sir Jimmy was a rapist pervert. I haven't had the chance to see the trial transcript either. Could somebody post a link to them please?
my power improvement experiment blog

Rule number 100: It's your bike and your money and your time; do what you like with it and ignore other peoples' rules. Except this one.

dylanfernley
Posts: 400
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 20:29 pm
Contact:

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby dylanfernley » Tue Oct 02, 2012 19:30 pm

all in good time, but it does not sound good, for his supporters i mean

User avatar
Yellow Peril
Posts: 4401
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2007 08:41 am

Re: Jimmy Saville "sex fiend"?

Postby Yellow Peril » Tue Oct 02, 2012 20:00 pm

dylanfernley wrote:all in good time, but it does not sound good, for his supporters i mean


Cover up by authorities, threatening people with big bucks litigation and ^this... is this a Lance Armstrong thread?


Return to “The Cake Stop”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests