It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

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CookeeeMonster
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby CookeeeMonster » Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:22 am

I had the same questions a little while ago (worried about the same thing, and have m520's).

To make things worse shimano brought out these recently: http://road.cc/content/news/63565-just-shimano-click%E2%80%99r-pedals - they seem pretty perfect :) (but as I only bought the m520's a couple of months ago I cant justify buying these so soon...maybe when the price comes down in a sale)
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cougie
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby cougie » Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:12 pm

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3M-Diamond-Gr ... e9f&_uhb=1

There you go Cookee - saved you some cash there...

racingcondor
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby racingcondor » Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:45 pm

The only road pedals I've seen with reflectors were my old Time RXS which had two little screw on reflectors in the bag.

Personally I would hope that my reflective Hump rucksack cover would lead to any lawyer arguing that my lack of other reflectors (in a rear end accident) mattered would get laughed out of court.

whitebirdyman
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby whitebirdyman » Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:58 pm

I have the Shimano reflector platforms mentioned earlier in this thread by Craker. I bought a pair of M520 pedals from ebay as a split pack w/o cleats and surprisingly they came with the platform. I left them on as just using that bike for local trips and doing longer runs on another. It is a nuisance losing the double-sided clip facility but the platforms are ok. However, I do not think the reflectors add anything to night time visibility if you already have reflective gear and lights.

I think that rather than the dark, one of the biggest hazards in winter is the low sun on a clear day which causes glare and gets in drivers eyes just before the sun goes down. Maybe I was being a little over-cautious, but I cut a ride short last week as I realised I could not see into the sun, so probably drivers behind might struggle to see me - lights and reflectors would not help much in that situation.

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barrowmatt
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby barrowmatt » Fri Nov 16, 2012 17:55 pm

john1967 wrote:my bike didnt even come with pedals let alone reflectors on the pedals.Does that mean my bike was illegal when i bought it?


If you rode it without pedals then possibly :lol:

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lotus49
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby lotus49 » Fri Nov 16, 2012 18:14 pm

In the case of contributory negligence the important aspect that the court would consider is not whether you were legal or not but whether what you did or did not do materially contributed to either the likelihood of the accident taking place in the first place or the extent of your injury.

Since pedal reflectors make almost no practical difference then whether you had them or not is not relevant. If you were lit up like a Christmas tree, pedal reflectors would absolutely not make you more materially more visible so the fact that you should have been using them to comply with the law but were not, would not be contributory negligence.

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diy
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby diy » Fri Nov 16, 2012 18:39 pm

Pedal reflectors are a legal requirement, if the bike is ridden after dark. Bike shop is taking a self interest stance by saying effectively that they sold you pedals for day time use. Otherwise they are opening themselves up to some liability. There probably is a contributory negligence angle to be honest. However, I think you may have some challenges if the claimant was lit up like Xmas tree. Problem is there will be plenty of experts who will argue that moving reflectors make a big difference in visually recognising a cycle. Then it's not a big leap to say because there were no refectory moving with the pedals, I didn't realise the rider was on the road and moving. The only angle I could see is having some components on the bike pre 1985.

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unixnerd
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby unixnerd » Sat Nov 17, 2012 14:00 pm

One set of my double sided SPDs (M520s) came with a clip in platform with reflectors on each end so they were 'legal' and left one free clip mechanism. Take the platform off to restore two in sides.


So did mine. If I'm driving and see pedals with reflectors in the distance it lets me know I'm looking at a slow moving cyclist, not a motorbike. I always run a set at night.
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CookeeeMonster
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby CookeeeMonster » Sat Nov 17, 2012 21:13 pm

cougie wrote:http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3M-Diamond-Grade-Reflective-Tape-Yellow-4-50-Per-Metre-/300815986335?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CommercialVehicleParts_SM&hash=item460a07ae9f&_uhb=1

There you go Cookee - saved you some cash there...


cheers - if there was anywhere on the m520's to put that I'd seriously buy it :)
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unixnerd
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby unixnerd » Sat Nov 17, 2012 21:27 pm

http://www.strathspey.co.uk - Quality Binoculars at a Sensible Price.
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby marcruse » Sat Nov 17, 2012 21:43 pm

lotus49 wrote:In the case of contributory negligence the important aspect that the court would consider is not whether you were legal or not but whether what you did or did not do materially contributed to either the likelihood of the accident taking place in the first place or the extent of your injury.

Since pedal reflectors make almost no practical difference then whether you had them or not is not relevant. If you were lit up like a Christmas tree, pedal reflectors would absolutely not make you more materially more visible so the fact that you should have been using them to comply with the law but were not, would not be contributory negligence.


Not wishing to be morbid here, but being lit up like a Christmas Tree is probably not much help "after the event". If you're in a heap at the roadside with a twisted bike, it would be hard to prove that in the circumstances immediately before the accident, the lighting and other reflectors were adequate. The BMW driver (bound to be a BMW driver!) could argue that the particular conditions still made the cyclist difficult to see. Smartarse Lawyer would then argue contributory negligence through lack of pedal reflectors.

If you are in court defending your position, being a lawbreaker (through not having pedal reflectors) is hardly going to help your case.

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unixnerd
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby unixnerd » Sat Nov 17, 2012 21:52 pm

The BMW driver (bound to be a BMW driver!)


I've had a BMW website longer than BMW have had one, not all BMW drivers are demons out to get cyclists. It's a bit like drivers complaining that all cyclists run red lights and it doesn't help.
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby marcruse » Sat Nov 17, 2012 21:53 pm



That's a neat idea; I haven't seen them, but I suspect they wouldn't help if you want to wear SPD shoes as they the seem to clip into the side you would use with non-SPD shoes. Presumably they would drop out if they were underneath the pedal and you were using SPDs on the top. Still, at that price they're worth investigating. Thanks for the tip.

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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby marcruse » Sat Nov 17, 2012 21:59 pm

unixnerd wrote:
The BMW driver (bound to be a BMW driver!)


I've had a BMW website longer than BMW have had one, not all BMW drivers are demons out to get cyclists. It's a bit like drivers complaining that all cyclists run red lights and it doesn't help.


Sorry, cheap joke. I'm a BMW driver too. Good to know there's two of us that don't hate cyclists :D

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unixnerd
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby unixnerd » Sat Nov 17, 2012 22:11 pm

That's a neat idea; I haven't seen them, but I suspect they wouldn't help if you want to wear SPD shoes as they the seem to clip into the side you would use with non-SPD shoes. Presumably they would drop out if they were underneath the pedal and you were using SPDs on the top. Still, at that price they're worth investigating. Thanks for the tip.


They clip firmly into the pedal and go on the bottom when in use, they don't fall out (in fact they're murder to remove). The pedal hangs horizontally when in use so they actually make it slightly easier to clip in :-)

You can flip them over and use them to pedal on if you don't want to clip in. I'm assuming you have double sided SPDs such as M520s, they'd not work for single sided SPDs of course.
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CookeeeMonster
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Re: It's too dangerous to cycle after dark! Really?

Postby CookeeeMonster » Sun Nov 18, 2012 11:08 am

unixnerd wrote:
That's a neat idea; I haven't seen them, but I suspect they wouldn't help if you want to wear SPD shoes as they the seem to clip into the side you would use with non-SPD shoes. Presumably they would drop out if they were underneath the pedal and you were using SPDs on the top. Still, at that price they're worth investigating. Thanks for the tip.


They clip firmly into the pedal and go on the bottom when in use, they don't fall out (in fact they're murder to remove). The pedal hangs horizontally when in use so they actually make it slightly easier to clip in :-)

You can flip them over and use them to pedal on if you don't want to clip in. I'm assuming you have double sided SPDs such as M520s, they'd not work for single sided SPDs of course.


The one thing that put me off these were that they would be a pain to clip into but if you're saying it's easier...maybe I'll give them a try as the shimano ones are only £3.99
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