punctures / tyres...some advice please

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punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Prando » Mon Dec 03, 2012 19:38 pm

Having just picked up my 2nd puncture (rear) in less than 10 rides, I am keen to ensure I am taking the correct precautions.

I understand that luck plays a part here, and prior to my recent misfortune, I had ridden some 2000 miles (in bouts of circa 40 miles) puncture free. So herewith my questions...

1) Are some tyres, less susceptible to punctures ? If so, which ones ?
2) Same question with inner tubes
3) Is the 'green gel' squirty stuff worth injecting ?
4) Are so called "puncture resistant" tyres worth a go ?
5) Are pressures relevant ? My tyres are 700 x 25c and I inflate to 100psi which is the max as stated on the rim. (They are the tyres that came with the bike a carrera virtuosa)

Any other advice .

Thanks

Paul
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Gizmodo » Mon Dec 03, 2012 19:55 pm

1) See http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=40013&t=12878068
2) also covered in the post above, short answer, no
3) No again
4) It is worth trying a quality tire if yours are rubbish
5) Yes, see http://sheldonbrown.com/tires.html#pressure

Quality tires, correctly inflated for your weight and tire width, and don't ride in the gutter. The rest is luck.
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Prando » Mon Dec 03, 2012 20:16 pm

Thanks Gismo buddy, some interesting stuff. I'll do the research and check the bank balance :-)
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Simon Masterson » Mon Dec 03, 2012 20:28 pm

Puncture-resistant tyres are well worth using for 'real world' cycling; and by that I mean tyres that are specifically designed for the purpose, as most have some level of protection.

Really tough ones (eg. Marathon Plus) are quite a bit heavier for it, but hopefully you won't need that level of defence! Simply designating 'quality' tyres is an oversimplification; featherweight silk racing tyres are of a very high quality. Puncture-resistant tyres just have tough breaker belts that either resist sharps or are so thick that they [hopefully] won't get through; Schwalbe boast that you can stick a drawing pin in a Marathon Plus.

There are a few good tough tyres around that are worth considering. I'll let others speak for those they've used, and comment on the Gatorskin, which is a very popular choice anyway. I use these partly because I have very few choices for 27" wheels, and they are 27 x 1 1/4" or 32mm, which I run at 85PSI, but nevertheless I've been very pleased with them and have had them on since May; no punctures.

As for the 'green gel', I wouldn't use it and haven't heard any good reports, but remedies of its ilk do work; MTB riders using tubeless tyres use sealant, as do many road cyclists using tubulars (whether as a remedy for punctures or in the tyre as a preventative); including some professionals.

But I think Gizmodo gave the bottom line; avoiding riding over broken bottles and big holes is the most important thing; and there are some things that will puncture every tyre except a solid rubber one. :lol:
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Pigtail » Mon Dec 03, 2012 20:47 pm

Stock tyres with many bikes are poor. Changing them should be the first upgrade for most people, particularly after they begin to puncture.
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby DaxPlusPlus » Mon Dec 03, 2012 23:19 pm

Its been said by others in other posts about checking your tyres for debris (flints, thorns, etc) and removing them before they worm their way in deeper.

I now do this. Every few hundred miles, I'll give the bike a clean and at the same time whip the wheels off, wash them and inspect them. It's a very theraputic and does probably help. It's also a real eye opener to the hammering that the tyres take.
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Simon E » Tue Dec 04, 2012 20:41 pm

This is just MHO:

1) Yes e.g. Schwalbe Durano Plus, Bontrager Race Lite Hardcase, Conti GP4Season, Specialized Armadillo.
2) No. Anything that penetrates a tyre won't have a problem slicing through the inner tube.
3) No.
4) Definitely. They have a tough layer under the tread that resists thorns, glass etc.
5) Yes. As its name implies, max pressure is an upper limit and I'd suggest only suitable for heavy riders. I'm 63kg and find 80psi fine for 700x25c.

Most tyres are more susceptible to punctures as the tread wears down.
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Mr Will » Wed Dec 05, 2012 13:15 pm

Simon E wrote:Most tyres are more susceptible to punctures as the tread wears down.


This. It is likely your tyres are getting worn out and will be massively susceptible to punctures until replaced.

Continental GP 4-Seasons would be my choice to replace them. Gatorskins/Marathons/etc are overkill and not worth the tradeoff IMHO.
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Bozman » Wed Dec 05, 2012 14:04 pm

Punctures are down to luck and that's it.
I generally ride around country lanes on 23 vittoria open corsa evo cx tyres, road after road covered in thorns in the autumn, grit and potholes for the rest of the year, i got my first puncture in well over a year and thousands of miles the other week........ the tyres? No, just luck.
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Simon Masterson » Wed Dec 05, 2012 20:57 pm

Mr Will wrote:
Simon E wrote:Most tyres are more susceptible to punctures as the tread wears down.


This. It is likely your tyres are getting worn out and will be massively susceptible to punctures until replaced.

Continental GP 4-Seasons would be my choice to replace them. Gatorskins/Marathons/etc are overkill and not worth the tradeoff IMHO.


According to the Conti site, Gatorskin (folding) and GP4S are the same weight. (both 220g for a 700x23)

Not everyone is as fortunate as you evidently are, but Gatorskins are good enough for Elinor Barker. ;)
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Rolf F » Wed Dec 05, 2012 21:24 pm

Mr Will wrote:
Simon E wrote:Most tyres are more susceptible to punctures as the tread wears down.


This. It is likely your tyres are getting worn out and will be massively susceptible to punctures until replaced.


These NOT! :lol:

Your puncture rate shouldn't really increase unless the tyres are really worn. Mostly it is the puncture belt that protects your inner tube and not the rubber. What does happen is that stuff gets imbedded as already said and effectively gives you delayed punctures (or repeat punctures if you are really dim and fail to spot a big chunk of glass that the tyre rubber had neatly wrapped around like I did a few weeks back.....). Keep checking and removing.

The real problem here is likely that you are running the tyres that came with the bike. Really, you'll find decent tyres better in so many ways.

And never, ever buy anything from Schwalbe with a "+" on the sidewall. If you are a bit of a masochist it's far more pleasant and useful to pay a young lady with a whip to come over than to ride a bike with Marathon Pluses on it!
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Mr Will » Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:41 pm

Simon Masterson wrote:According to the Conti site, Gatorskin (folding) and GP4S are the same weight. (both 220g for a 700x23)

Not everyone is as fortunate as you evidently are, but Gatorskins are good enough for Elinor Barker. ;)


Who said anything about weight? I'll take a more comfortable and grippy tyre over one with slightly more puncture protection, but I do acknowledge it all comes down to personal preference.
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Mr Will » Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:50 pm

Rolf F wrote:Your puncture rate shouldn't really increase unless the tyres are really worn. Mostly it is the puncture belt that protects your inner tube and not the rubber. What does happen is that stuff gets imbedded as already said and effectively gives you delayed punctures (or repeat punctures if you are really dim and fail to spot a big chunk of glass that the tyre rubber had neatly wrapped around like I did a few weeks back.....). Keep checking and removing.


I have no evidence to contradict you but my experience teaches my otherwise. Once the rubber gets thin the distance between the puncture belt and the tarmac reduces. I think that this means that small objects (which wouldn't have been a problem for a newer tyre) end up forced against the puncture belt with sufficient pressure to make their way through and hole the inner tube.
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Rolf F » Thu Dec 06, 2012 15:03 pm

Mr Will wrote:I have no evidence to contradict you but my experience teaches my otherwise. Once the rubber gets thin the distance between the puncture belt and the tarmac reduces. I think that this means that small objects (which wouldn't have been a problem for a newer tyre) end up forced against the puncture belt with sufficient pressure to make their way through and hole the inner tube.


It's possible that geography plays a part. For example, in W Yorks there is no flint and maybe tyres get more sensitive to flint than, say, glass when they get thin. My experience is that the punctures only increase when the rubber is wafer thin and the carcass about to start making an appearance - provided you do keep removing the foreign objects.
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Simon E » Thu Dec 06, 2012 15:08 pm

Mr Will wrote:
Rolf F wrote:Your puncture rate shouldn't really increase unless the tyres are really worn. Mostly it is the puncture belt that protects your inner tube and not the rubber.

I have no evidence to contradict you but my experience teaches my otherwise.

While I agree with Rolf F, I too find that I rarely get punctures until my tyres are quite worn. Why it generally happens that way I really don't know. I check my tyres frequently.

Last week a tiny 4mm shard of glass got through my rear City Jet but this otherwise excellent tyre lacks a decent puncture belt beneath the tread. I used it as an excuse to replace them with Marathon Racers, currently reduced at SJS.

Simon Masterson wrote:Gatorskins are good enough for Elinor Barker. ;)

It's irrelevant, like which pedals or energy drink she uses. I'd be more concerned about the dozens of people on here and elsewhere that find Gatorskins very sketchy in wet conditions. Perhaps you like using them (which is fine) or do you have a stock of Gators you can't shift? :wink:
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Re: punctures / tyres...some advice please

Postby Ouija » Thu Dec 06, 2012 15:25 pm

+1 for Gatorskins. They are one of the better ones for puncture protection if you still want to keep the weights light. Marathon Plus are indestructible if weight isn't an issue and plain Marathons for something inbetween.

Can always make your own also. Take something light, like the Gatorskin, and put one of those gel anti-puncture stick on strips around the inside of the tyre and then use Kenda thorn resistant inner tubes, which have 2mm thick rubber on the road side of the tube (1mm thick everywhere else). Still lighter than a Marathon Plus and standard tube combo with similar levels of protection.
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