Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

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Imposter
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby Imposter » Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:10 am

VTech wrote:so ive stuck with the bmx on the trainer


BMX on a turbo - that's got to be worth posting a pic, surely ?

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VTech
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby VTech » Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:24 am

I can do that :)
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springtide9
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby springtide9 » Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:34 am

VTech wrote:
springtide9 wrote:Errhhh... so putting a carbon bike on a turbo causes more stress to the frame than say hitting a deep pothole at 40mph?


You don't hit a pothole 80-120 times a minute for 2 hours !


Do they also put warnings out stating that they don't recommend using their frames if you are a very strong sprinter?

I mean, is there a maximum wattage rating for the frame before it snaps?

A decent sprinter maybe putting out 2000-2500 watts on the road; I would guess the average Joe Blogs peaks at more like 800 watts on a trainer, which is a 3x difference.
Then there is the weight consideration.. Does a 10 stone man put the same stress on the frame as opposed to a 20 stone man?

What I stating is that as with all things in life, a little bit of practical thinking / common sense is the order of the day.
Simon

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VTech
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby VTech » Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:44 am

springtide9 wrote:
VTech wrote:
springtide9 wrote:Errhhh... so putting a carbon bike on a turbo causes more stress to the frame than say hitting a deep pothole at 40mph?


You don't hit a pothole 80-120 times a minute for 2 hours !


Do they also put warnings out stating that they don't recommend using their frames if you are a very strong sprinter?

I mean, is there a maximum wattage rating for the frame before it snaps?

A decent sprinter maybe putting out 2000-2500 watts on the road; I would guess the average Joe Blogs peaks at more like 800 watts on a trainer, which is a 3x difference.
Then there is the weight consideration.. Does a 10 stone man put the same stress on the frame as opposed to a 20 stone man?

What I stating is that as with all things in life, a little bit of practical thinking / common sense is the order of the day.



The problem is that it doesnt always work like that. I work with carbon myself (not making but in my industry) and there is a difference between free and fixed motion.
On like for like, I doubt a 10 or 20 stone man would cause as much stress on the road as he would on a trainer at the "fixing" point, in fact I absolutely guarantee it.
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MarkP80
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby MarkP80 » Wed Jan 30, 2013 12:54 pm

VTech wrote:I didnt intend my comments to be argumentative, just passing on what I was told.
quote]
I didn't personally take them that way, I was just saying how I would react if a manufacturer tried to fob me off, I wasn't having a go at you.

VTech wrote:Iso ive stuck with the bmx on the trainer for the minute.

:shock: Respect!!!
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby Johncp » Wed Jan 30, 2013 13:09 pm

If you haven't got a headwind you're not trying hard enough

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springtide9
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby springtide9 » Wed Jan 30, 2013 14:55 pm

VTech wrote:
The problem is that it doesnt always work like that. I work with carbon myself (not making but in my industry) and there is a difference between free and fixed motion.
On like for like, I doubt a 10 or 20 stone man would cause as much stress on the road as he would on a trainer at the "fixing" point, in fact I absolutely guarantee it.


As a FYI
One of carbons failings is that it is perceived as being not particularly stiff unless designed correctly. Aluminium is a much stiffer material with a lot less give.
With this in mind, you are better off on a turbo on a carbon, Ti or steel frame bike rather than on an Aluminium.

I know many people who own turbos, with bikes made form all sorts of materials... for most of them, they are completely oblivious to the stresses that any form of riding puts on a frame or any other component... they just ride unaware of the technicalities.
I have not yet meet a person who has stated they have damaged their bike by riding on a turbo. If you are really concerned, maybe the Kurt Rock an Roll is the turbo for you.
Simon

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VTech
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby VTech » Wed Jan 30, 2013 16:11 pm

springtide9 wrote:
VTech wrote:
The problem is that it doesnt always work like that. I work with carbon myself (not making but in my industry) and there is a difference between free and fixed motion.
On like for like, I doubt a 10 or 20 stone man would cause as much stress on the road as he would on a trainer at the "fixing" point, in fact I absolutely guarantee it.


As a FYI
One of carbons failings is that it is perceived as being not particularly stiff unless designed correctly. Aluminium is a much stiffer material with a lot less give.
With this in mind, you are better off on a turbo on a carbon, Ti or steel frame bike rather than on an Aluminium.

I know many people who own turbos, with bikes made form all sorts of materials... for most of them, they are completely oblivious to the stresses that any form of riding puts on a frame or any other component... they just ride unaware of the technicalities.
I have not yet meet a person who has stated they have damaged their bike by riding on a turbo. If you are really concerned, maybe the Kurt Rock an Roll is the turbo for you.


This has turned into a great debate but again, my only reason for not putting mine on is that i would prefer to fit a cheaper bike to it, I am looking for a cheaper bike on ebay and if thats carbon or alloy I am happy to use that.
Obviously a turbo with a fixed point will add more stress to that point but wether or not to a level that could cause damage is something I dont know and as you mention above, would it be any worse with other materials ?
I come into contact with lots of carbon, very high end carbon and from my experience the damage is rarely from abuse of stress but rather from impact which backs your theory.
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springtide9
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby springtide9 » Wed Jan 30, 2013 17:29 pm

VTech wrote:This has turned into a great debate but again, my only reason for not putting mine on is that i would prefer to fit a cheaper bike to it, I am looking for a cheaper bike on ebay and if thats carbon or alloy I am happy to use that.
Obviously a turbo with a fixed point will add more stress to that point but wether or not to a level that could cause damage is something I dont know and as you mention above, would it be any worse with other materials ?
I come into contact with lots of carbon, very high end carbon and from my experience the damage is rarely from abuse of stress but rather from impact which backs your theory.


You obviously have yet to experience hitting a pothole at 40+mph :-) When you do, the sound will be like the whole bike is about to explode, but don't worry, you can then stop treating your carbon dream machine as a fragile work of art, and realise that they really are pretty strong.

Check out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5z1fSpZNXhU

It's not a debate, just people trying to explain to you that your fears of breakage is unfounded, and there is no requirement to waste your money on a second bike (although a second wheel is useful)

But it's your money, so buy another bike if it makes you feel happy.
Simon

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VTech
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby VTech » Wed Jan 30, 2013 17:35 pm

Loved that video :)
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ShutUpLegs
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby ShutUpLegs » Wed Jan 30, 2013 18:25 pm

VTech wrote:Loved that video :)


More attention seeking
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VTech
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby VTech » Wed Jan 30, 2013 18:44 pm

ShutUpLegs wrote:
VTech wrote:Loved that video :)


More attention seeking


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d87francis
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby d87francis » Wed Jan 30, 2013 19:03 pm

Imposter wrote:
VTech wrote:so ive stuck with the bmx on the trainer


BMX on a turbo - that's got to be worth posting a pic, surely ?

That was exactly my thoughts. Please VTech can we have a picture of you on your bmx on a turbo. :D

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smidsy
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby smidsy » Wed Jan 30, 2013 19:44 pm

It is a Mountain bike not a BMX or BMW - keep up!!!
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VTech
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby VTech » Wed Jan 30, 2013 20:11 pm

Here :)

excuse the mess, the room is yet to be completed.

Image
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ArdyOCD
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby ArdyOCD » Thu Jan 31, 2013 13:49 pm

Funny looking bmx....
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VTech
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby VTech » Thu Jan 31, 2013 14:07 pm

ArdyOCD wrote:Funny looking bmx....



I had earlier explained that the comment "BMX" was actually an error as I was really referring to a mountain bike, sorry.
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birdie23
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby birdie23 » Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:37 am

springtide9 wrote:
VTech wrote:This has turned into a great debate but again, my only reason for not putting mine on is that i would prefer to fit a cheaper bike to it, I am looking for a cheaper bike on ebay and if thats carbon or alloy I am happy to use that.
Obviously a turbo with a fixed point will add more stress to that point but wether or not to a level that could cause damage is something I dont know and as you mention above, would it be any worse with other materials ?
I come into contact with lots of carbon, very high end carbon and from my experience the damage is rarely from abuse of stress but rather from impact which backs your theory.


You obviously have yet to experience hitting a pothole at 40+mph :-) When you do, the sound will be like the whole bike is about to explode, but don't worry, you can then stop treating your carbon dream machine as a fragile work of art, and realise that they really are pretty strong.

Check out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5z1fSpZNXhU

It's not a debate, just people trying to explain to you that your fears of breakage is unfounded, and there is no requirement to waste your money on a second bike (although a second wheel is useful)

But it's your money, so buy another bike if it makes you feel happy.


I hit a pothole on my carbon bike on Friday at 25mph, all I heard was me going "arghhhh" as I departed the bike for the asphalt.
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lef
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby lef » Sun Feb 03, 2013 14:35 pm

Rollers all the way. No extra stress to the frame and it builds core, bike handling, smooth pedalling and with practice you can sprint on them, one leg drills etc. and no problem with doing threshold intervals.

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bernithebiker
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Re: Carbon frames on turbo trainers, can it cause damage?

Postby bernithebiker » Sun Feb 03, 2013 14:42 pm

lef wrote:Rollers all the way. No extra stress to the frame and it builds core, bike handling, smooth pedalling and with practice you can sprint on them, one leg drills etc. and no problem with doing threshold intervals.


Don't mention smooth pedalling or one leg drills round here, or this thread will quickly go to 8 pages.....! :lol:
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