Large (or Giant) bull ***t

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flappy
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Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby flappy » Fri Apr 26, 2013 17:08 pm

Saw the review of the Giant Anthem x 29er 1 and decided to take a look.

Jumped to the Full specs section and looked for the weight and found this gem
How much does this bike weigh? It’s a common question, and rightly so. But the truth is, there are no industry standards for claiming bike weights—and this leads to a lot of misinformation. Variances exist based on size, frame material, finish and hardware. And as bikes get lighter, these differences become more critical. At Giant, we believe the only way to truly know the weight of any particular bike is to find out for yourself at your local retailer.

What a load of crap that is. I've thought of a method that could help Giant out. Get small framed model, put on scales, record result, put it on website under weight (S). Get medium framed model, put on scales, record result, put it on website under weight (M). This method can be extended to work with large and extra large frames too. It will work whether the finish is matt or gloss, and will cope with frames made of alloy or carbon. It also works with sugar, potatoes, and flour for fairy cakes.
At Giant, we believe the only way to truly know the weight of any particular bike is to find out for yourself at your local retailer

The Giant 'boutique' near me can't even tell me the weight.......

RockmonkeySC
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby RockmonkeySC » Fri Apr 26, 2013 17:51 pm

Manufacturers claimed weights are meaningless. They are all weighed differently and very few are done with the bike in the state it reaches the shop. Most calculate weights using claimed weights of components added on to the weight of a raw, unpainted frame. They don't include cables or fork oil. Some take the weight that their CAD modelling software says that the frame will be.
It's just a meaningless figure which has no relation to what you actually get.
My Nukeproof Scalp is a pound and a bit heavier than claimed, my mates Specialized Enduro is three quarters of a pound over the claimed weight. My local shop put a Cannondale 29er on their scales and that was just over half a pound over.
Giant are saying that rather than give you a figure which cannot be accurately compared to other manufacturers claimed weights which may or may not be correct they will leave it up to you to test ride or pick one up in your local shop and see what you think.

flappy
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby flappy » Fri Apr 26, 2013 18:08 pm

The should (and could) weigh a built up version of any particular model. Not just Giant - all of them. If they claim weight without oils or essential cables they are misrepresenting their products under consumer law. What if Tate & Lyle only put 900g of sugar in a 1kg packet?

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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby RockmonkeySC » Fri Apr 26, 2013 18:34 pm

Thats not true. They aren't selling by weight. Weights are calculated and in some cases given to marketing types long before even the first prototype is built. Engineers will be given target weights for the frame and use the properties in their CAD software to hit or exceed those targets. Also bike manufacturers use lots of components that they buy in, if Shimano increase the weight of the cranks or Fox increase the weights of their forks does that mean that every manufacturer who uses those parts then has to re-issue all marketing info with revised weights? Also very few manufacturers build their own frames so they don't even have 100% control over them.

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bennett_346
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby bennett_346 » Fri Apr 26, 2013 18:38 pm

What the hell has sugar got to do with a bike?

I think Giant are right not to publish a "weight" since some sly manufacturer could weigh theirs with no pedals, lightweight tyres, helium in the forks etc etc and thus Giant could lose out on a sale because some idiot belived the dodgy "weight" on the other manufacturers website and decided it was lighter (even if it wasn't).

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cooldad
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby cooldad » Fri Apr 26, 2013 18:46 pm

I enjoy these OCD threads.
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ddraver
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby ddraver » Fri Apr 26, 2013 19:05 pm

Hah, yeah that's pretty lame...

They may as well just put "Yes, to be honest our bikes weigh a little bit more that others, but it ll make no difference to the 99% of non racers that buy our bikes as they ll never notice. If you want light just buy Scott or Merida, we probably make them anyway so meh"
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby RockmonkeySC » Fri Apr 26, 2013 19:38 pm

Giant's bikes generally aren't the lightest but they don't tend to break very often

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nicklouse
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby nicklouse » Fri Apr 26, 2013 19:41 pm

flappy wrote:The Giant 'boutique' near me can't even tell me the weight.......

Image

sorted.
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Bartimaeus
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby Bartimaeus » Fri Apr 26, 2013 21:36 pm

Very much this ^

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Clank
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby Clank » Fri Apr 26, 2013 21:47 pm

To be fair, if this is the most important thing the OP has to get wound up about, I envy the dude.

He's gonna be mightily p****d when he finds out the Specialized concept store can't sell him the Ark of The Covenent.
Last edited by Clank on Fri Apr 26, 2013 21:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bartimaeus
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby Bartimaeus » Fri Apr 26, 2013 21:50 pm

And of course no one will ever weigh one of them for you... oh hang on

Weight (kg):
12.2
Weight (lb):
26.8

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supersonic
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby supersonic » Fri Apr 26, 2013 22:55 pm

To be honest, it annoys me too ie why they cannot weigh a specified spec.

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nicklouse
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby nicklouse » Fri Apr 26, 2013 22:59 pm

supersonic wrote:To be honest, it annoys me too ie why they cannot weigh a specified spec.

But why would they? As no other maker would measure the same spec but would weigh a lighter one.

If any thing hey should list frame weights. Bare for fullys.

And by bare I mean in retail condition but with nothing fitted but again for a fully all pivots present but no shock.
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supersonic
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby supersonic » Fri Apr 26, 2013 23:12 pm

Either way, is not hard to do. X bike with Y spec weighs Z pounds.

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stubs
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby stubs » Sat Apr 27, 2013 08:21 am

Surely the best way of weighing a bike is to pick it up, if it feels okay then thats it its the right weight. Got 2 bikes and I couldnt tell you the weight of either I just know that the rigid single speed with only a front brake and slick tyres weighs about 6 or 7 ish pounds less than the bouncer with 18 speeds and big bars.
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97th choice
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby 97th choice » Sat Apr 27, 2013 08:39 am

My lbs has scales hanging from ceiling for just this scenario. They are truly groundbreaking.

On the subject of weights, if manufactured components have a weight tolerance or variation, then when you factor all those in you could have a not insignificant difference. So, you go look at a bike that is claimed as 12.5kg +/- 0.5kg are you going to get the shop to weigh all they stock so you get the lightest one?
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bluechair84
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby bluechair84 » Sat Apr 27, 2013 09:57 am

Even geometry can be off from the stated numbers on the spec. But really, aren't these variances small enough that you wouldn't notice? I 'upgraded' to carbon bars and post, didn't notice the difference in weight. Waste of money IME. But yes, I agree that manufacturers should be more rigorous with their specs (which won't happen).

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Kowalski675
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby Kowalski675 » Sun Apr 28, 2013 19:33 pm

nicklouse wrote:
flappy wrote:The Giant 'boutique' near me can't even tell me the weight.......

Image

sorted.


I've got a set just like that, but with yellow handle and buttons, lol. Coincidentally, I just weighed my bike with them this afternoon.

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Kowalski675
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Re: Large (or Giant) bull ***t

Postby Kowalski675 » Sun Apr 28, 2013 19:35 pm

ddraver wrote:Hah, yeah that's pretty lame...

They may as well just put "Yes, to be honest our bikes weigh a little bit more that others, but it ll make no difference to the 99% of non racers that buy our bikes as they ll never notice. If you want light just buy Scott or Merida, we probably make them anyway so meh"


I like that post. :lol:


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