Groupset compatibility - shifting woes ...

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extrusion
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Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2012 13:46 pm

Groupset compatibility - shifting woes ...

Postby extrusion » Fri Jun 21, 2013 09:02 am

Hi, looking for some advice here before I start breaking things :evil:


Short version:

Are Tiagra 4600 shifters compatible with an Ultegra 6700 cassette and 105 rear derailleur?


Long version:

I had a full Tiagra 4600 groupset on my Ribble Gran Fondo, then changed the front mech and cassette to Ultegra, chain to KMC x10sl. Shifting was flawless.

Hanger broke and knacked the rear derailleur and chain, tore some paint off the frame, bent a few spokes.

Ribble said the frame was fine and put a new hanger on. The bolts are now so tight that they bent my allen key and rounded the screw hole when i tried to replace it (reasons below).

Anyways, I replaced the chain. KMX X10-SL.

(I'll call this bit Point A): Shifting not quite right, won't go up or down in one gear and hesitant to drop near the smaller teeth rings. Loosen cable so it drops easier and it won't climb up near the middle ring.

Replaced the cable. Shimano something or other. See Point A.

Replaced the cassette. Ultegra 6700. See Point A.

Noticed that the derailleur wasn't hanging straight, used an old rear axle to bend it back so it looked right. This cured the problem somewhat with feeling like there was too much pull at the bigger rings (i.e. easy to accidentally skip up 2). However. See Point A.

Bought new hanger. Can't get old one off.

Bought the Park Tools derailleur tool. Yes, that's right! And that hurt. But not as much as when I discovered the hanger was perfectly straight! See Point A.

So I'm going to replace the outers and see if that makes any difference but the question is are the 4600 shifters compatible with a 105 derailleur and 6700 cassette? Because it seems that either the derailleur isn't working properly or the gaps on the 3rd or 4th ring are too wide. Bear in mind I had 4600 shifters and a 4600 derailleur before and it worked fine.

I have tried this with and without the cassette spacer as well.

I would think the frame was twisted if it wasn't that it was carbon ...


It's really annoying!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! <goes into a corner and cries>

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nicklouse
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Re: Groupset compatibility - shifting woes ...

Postby nicklouse » Fri Jun 21, 2013 09:08 am

yes.

when you change the outers change the inners at the same time.

PS what size inners did you use?

to me it sounds like cruddy cables.
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smidsy
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Re: Groupset compatibility - shifting woes ...

Postby smidsy » Fri Jun 21, 2013 09:09 am

In answer to your short question, yes as long as shifters are same speed as cassette.

I have not read the long one.
Yellow is the new Black.

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extrusion
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Re: Groupset compatibility - shifting woes ...

Postby extrusion » Fri Jun 21, 2013 11:28 am

nicklouse wrote:yes.

when you change the outers change the inners at the same time.

PS what size inners did you use?

to me it sounds like cruddy cables.


It was a standard Shimano road Gear cable, not sure what size. This time I have ordered a Shimano Road Gear Cable set with SST Inner Wire from wiggle (can't post link as wiggle doesn't load properly at work for some reason!), so cable and outers will be done at the same time. Should i invest in special cutters?? I have a guitar string cutter and that worked okayish last time.

jomoj
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Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2004 16:25 pm

Re: Groupset compatibility - shifting woes ...

Postby jomoj » Fri Jun 21, 2013 12:25 pm

if it's not the cables then check the top jockey wheel moves freely from side to side. It has a little room to slide so it self centres the chain on the sprocket. If it's restricted then shifting can be affected, similarly if its too worn and sloppy.

blackhands
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Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 16:17 pm

Re: Groupset compatibility - shifting woes ...

Postby blackhands » Mon Jun 24, 2013 19:55 pm

Make sure that you have the cable clamped correctly on the rear gear. If you put it on the wrong side of the bolt it affects the amount of pull. You can download a tech document from the Shimano website.

Its a coomon error to get this wrong.

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extrusion
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Re: Groupset compatibility - shifting woes ...

Postby extrusion » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:45 am

Well I fitted another cable, replaced the outers and end caps and this time the shifting is spot on! Also, as I bought proper cable cutters, the job took about fifteen minutes all in. Well pleased with myself.

Just one thing, i wasn't sure what some of the end caps were for so just put four of the same on the one side. Turns out 2 of the unused are sealed caps (1 metal, 1 with four rings instead of 2) so probably should have gone on the rear derailleur ends of the outer? Never mind.

Thanks for your help.


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