"Intelligent" light system

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Andy9964
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"Intelligent" light system

Postby Andy9964 » Sat Oct 12, 2013 08:16 am

Apparently, it flashes faster or slower depending on your cadence, is aware when you approach roundabouts and stop, and also has some sort of crash mode if you have an off. All due to built in sensors and witchcraft.
Prices seem okay (depending on how bright it is of course)

http://www.stuff.tv/see-sense-makes-oth ... -dumb/news

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woodnut
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby woodnut » Sat Oct 12, 2013 09:59 am

"It can detect if you suddenly stop peddling or start peddling faster," :roll: Written by a journalist that is!
Pedalling FFS. or even pedaling (if you must), but please no more peddling
Light does look very clever, by the way.

onemoresolo
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby onemoresolo » Sat Oct 12, 2013 10:23 am

Maybe this is for a cycling salesman and the light indicates the speed you're doing business?

dilemna
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby dilemna » Sun Oct 13, 2013 22:24 pm

I give it 30 minutes before it breaks. The whole point of a light is that emits a constant beam or frequency of light as per the regulations governing bicycle lights. Gimmick DON'T waste your money and time. The best bike lights are Exposure lights.
Life is like a roll of toilet paper; long and useful, but always ends at the wrong moment. Anon.
Think how stupid the average person is.......
half of them are even more stupid than you first thought.

Slowbike
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby Slowbike » Mon Oct 14, 2013 08:24 am

One function that's not been publicised elsewhere is crash recognition: if you come to an abrupt stop with a shock, the See.Sense. lights will override their power management functions and flash like crazy to increase the chances of being seen.

That's about the only useful bit I can see ...

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ToeKnee
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby ToeKnee » Mon Oct 14, 2013 08:43 am

Slowbike wrote:
One function that's not been publicised elsewhere is crash recognition: if you come to an abrupt stop with a shock, the See.Sense. lights will override their power management functions and flash like crazy to increase the chances of being seen.

That's about the only useful bit I can see ...

Really? I'd rather they were flashing like crazy before I crashed/died.
Just another gimmick.
Seneca wrote:It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare; it is because we do not dare that they are difficult.

Specialized TriCross Sport+Ultegra+Rack&Bag+Guards+Exposure Lights - FCN 7
Track:Condor 653, MTB:GT Zaskar, Road & TT:Condors.

Slowbike
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby Slowbike » Mon Oct 14, 2013 08:55 am

ToeKnee wrote:
Slowbike wrote:
One function that's not been publicised elsewhere is crash recognition: if you come to an abrupt stop with a shock, the See.Sense. lights will override their power management functions and flash like crazy to increase the chances of being seen.

That's about the only useful bit I can see ...

Really? I'd rather they were flashing like crazy before I crashed/died.
Just another gimmick.

At the moment I just put one on steady flash - about 100bpm is the programmed rate. TBH, if a driver can't see it then (s)he really shouldn't be on the road ...
Once it gets dark then I'll put a second and possibly 3rd on - one is likely to be on steady ...

Usefullness of a crazyflashinglightonceIvecrashed ??? Not particularly high - but about the only "useful" bit that was there.

Bobbygloss
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby Bobbygloss » Mon Oct 14, 2013 09:04 am

ToeKnee wrote:
Slowbike wrote:
One function that's not been publicised elsewhere is crash recognition: if you come to an abrupt stop with a shock, the See.Sense. lights will override their power management functions and flash like crazy to increase the chances of being seen.

That's about the only useful bit I can see ...

Really? I'd rather they were flashing like crazy before I crashed/died.
Just another gimmick.

Exactly this, I think. Why would you want your lights to decide for themselves when it is safe to go dim?

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meanredspider
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby meanredspider » Mon Oct 14, 2013 18:57 pm

Now I'm working for a very well-known Dutch light manufacturer, maybe I should suggest to them that they make a cycling "mood light" which changes colour depending upon your mood :wink: Or provides ambience lighting for your ride to enhance your mood. It could even have a wake-up function to simulate sunrise on your way into work and sunset to relax you on your way home :wink: :)
ROAD < Scott Foil HMX Di2, Volagi Liscio Di2, Jamis Renegade Elite Di2, Cube Reaction Race > ROUGH

TGOTB
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby TGOTB » Tue Oct 15, 2013 09:21 am

meanredspider wrote:Now I'm working for a very well-known Dutch light manufacturer, maybe I should suggest to them that they make a cycling "mood light" which changes colour depending upon your mood :wink: Or provides ambience lighting for your ride to enhance your mood. It could even have a wake-up function to simulate sunrise on your way into work and sunset to relax you on your way home :wink: :)

What about a bike light system that creates a blue/purple glow on the road underneath your bike?
Pannier, 120rpm.

AlSee
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby AlSee » Tue Oct 15, 2013 10:54 am

So there's loads of sensors and 'intelligence' to decide what the rider is doing but having decided that all it can do is change the flashing or brightness a bit? Sounds like a lot of complexity for little gain. And they're not cheap.

philipmcaleese
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby philipmcaleese » Tue Oct 15, 2013 12:01 pm

Philip here – designer of See.Sense.

Many thanks for the posts, it’s great to see what people are thinking. See.Sense. has been design led by cyclists from the start. Listening to what you want and need is the only way to design a light!

Exposure are great lights and I use them as the benchmark (along with some of the newer lights from Lezyne). They’re part of the inspiration for the light I set out to design. In 2011, I took part in the OCBC cycle event in Singapore. One guy, out of thousands of entrants, had an Exposure Flare. He was really quick, and as he made his way through the pack, he was so visible, with a light that was so much better then everything else, that it redefined my definition of what a bike light should be.

In terms of durability, we’re really gone to town. There are no switches as these are weak points. Similarly, we’ve selected the best materials. Most lights use PMMA lenses, but these can be brittle if impacted. We’re trialling the same grade of polycarbonate used in the Apollo moon mission visors (GE Lexan).

In terms of brightness, there are appropriate levels I think. Much like car fog lights, you can have too much. See.Sense. is not designed to go dim when you don’t need it, it’s designed to be bright all the time and really striking when you need it most and when it’s appropriate. We’re not out to dazzle drivers with constantly blinding lights, we’re out to get their attention when we tend to be missed.

A lot of lights also focus their beam rearwards. Yet being “rear ended” is a very unusual and rare type of cycling accident. I’ve used a Fresnel lens to deliberately spread the light, improving your side visibility.

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Sketchley
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby Sketchley » Tue Oct 15, 2013 12:24 pm

Can you make a light for group riding please. One that recognises that you are at the back of the group and then makes your light brighter and dims when someone is riding in your wheel. That way when you move in front of someone you will not dazzle them (a problem with very bright rear lights) but if at the back you'll be providing max protection for the whole group.
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Genesis Equilibrium - FCN 3/4/5

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Sketchley
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby Sketchley » Tue Oct 15, 2013 12:28 pm

TGOTB wrote:
meanredspider wrote:Now I'm working for a very well-known Dutch light manufacturer, maybe I should suggest to them that they make a cycling "mood light" which changes colour depending upon your mood :wink: Or provides ambience lighting for your ride to enhance your mood. It could even have a wake-up function to simulate sunrise on your way into work and sunset to relax you on your way home :wink: :)

What about a bike light system that creates a blue/purple glow on the road underneath your bike?


+1 this. I like the idea of a light the lights you, the bike and road up around you. Making you much more visable and than a tiny red light.
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Chris

Genesis Equilibrium - FCN 3/4/5

philipmcaleese
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby philipmcaleese » Tue Oct 15, 2013 12:55 pm

Sketchley wrote:Can you make a light for group riding please. One that recognises that you are at the back of the group and then makes your light brighter and dims when someone is riding in your wheel. That way when you move in front of someone you will not dazzle them (a problem with very bright rear lights) but if at the back you'll be providing max protection for the whole group.


I would love to do this. Most of my testers are group riders and have asked for the same. (I'm a solo commuter.) The difficulty is in identification of your position in the group, which I haven't been able to crack with onboard sensors. I've done some work integrating a bluetooth module (for potential future products), so you could control a light from a smart phone on your handlebars. Most riders I know have Garmins rather than smartphones on their bikes...

Sketchley wrote:I like the idea of a light the lights you, the bike and road up around you. Making you much more visable and than a tiny red light.


We found this does work quite well, it's an unanticipated side effect of increasing the viewing angle. Do have a look at the attached image. I won't name the competitor lights, but at the top left is See.Sense. The others range from £5 to £99, all from credible manufacturers with one rated at 80 lumens (which is brighter when viewed from directly behind). All taken using the same fully manual settings on a digital SLR for complete fairness.

Bobbygloss
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby Bobbygloss » Tue Oct 15, 2013 14:22 pm

I think a larger illuminated surface works well. One of the most distinctive lights I've seen was a small red flasher light shining upwards onto a yellow jacket. The light unit itself was not visible from behind, but the whole of the back of the jacket was glowing.
That and the rotating orange lights on JCBs - visible for miles.

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junglist_matty
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby junglist_matty » Tue Oct 15, 2013 14:32 pm

SMART Lunar R2.... £15 and super bright, all you need.... I've got 2

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Sketchley
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby Sketchley » Tue Oct 15, 2013 16:22 pm

philipmcaleese wrote:
Sketchley wrote:Can you make a light for group riding please. One that recognises that you are at the back of the group and then makes your light brighter and dims when someone is riding in your wheel. That way when you move in front of someone you will not dazzle them (a problem with very bright rear lights) but if at the back you'll be providing max protection for the whole group.


I would love to do this. Most of my testers are group riders and have asked for the same. (I'm a solo commuter.) The difficulty is in identification of your position in the group, which I haven't been able to crack with onboard sensors. I've done some work integrating a bluetooth module (for potential future products), so you could control a light from a smart phone on your handlebars. Most riders I know have Garmins rather than smartphones on their bikes...



Have you thought about a front / back light combo? The back light could detect the presence of a front light behind it on the next bike and dim itself, the front light could detect the presence of the a rear light in front and do the same. I suspect simple infared transmitters and receivers could do this but I'm not an expert. This way you will only run full brightness on front of group (great for battery life and if the person in front shoulder checks to move out) and the rear would only be on maximum if you're at the back. It would require everyone to be running the same lights but for groups this could work really well.
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Chris

Genesis Equilibrium - FCN 3/4/5

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kieranb
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby kieranb » Fri Oct 25, 2013 13:08 pm

why not some device to measure distance to object behind you, emit a signal (infra-red, ultra-sonic ??) based on the return signal estimate distance to objects behind, adjust lighting, size of signal could indicate bike/car and adjust accordingly?

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Rolf F
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Re: "Intelligent" light system

Postby Rolf F » Fri Oct 25, 2013 15:28 pm

Given that there are a few interestingly useful ideas left for light development, it's strange how much focus there is on brightness when the brightest lights are already too bright and pointless functionality for the sake of it. Eg this ludicrous product - http://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/categ ... -r7-47710/

It genuinely seems to have nothing in its favour (aside from a shamefully high score from BR) and its sole claim to fame seems to be blue tooth compatibility! Anyone who is daft enough to buy one of these things needs to be reminded that what they are buying is a torch......

Just got an Exposure Joystick helmet setup with redeye (much thanks to George at Exposure for swapping the long cable redeye that Evans had supplied which I had no use for with a short cable redeye which is what I'd ordered - really excellent service there. Boo to Evans!) - much as I like my Smart R1s and 2s at the back, I feel happier having the redeye lighting me up as well.

I think what we need are just different, bright lights that flash differently and are in different places so we are illuminated as untidily and therefore distinctively as possible.
Faster than a tent.......


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