Road bike disc break dilemma

What bike and bike bits should you buy?
Tumba
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Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 20:26 pm

Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby Tumba » Wed Nov 06, 2013 15:43 pm

First time post so please be kind!

I am new to road biking. I bought my first bike in June of 2013. When I started biking I weighed 285 and am 6'3. I currently weigh 220. I have been bitten by the road bike bug and really love it. I did not think I would, but I really do. My ultimate goal is to get down to 200 pounds. I believe I can reach this goal with my new found love for road biking.

My current bike is the Specialized Secteur Sport Disc http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bikes/ ... -sport-dis

Being new to the sport and knowing nothing about frame materials, component hierarchy, companies etc. I chose an entry level bike that would give me in my mind the option to ride a little off road and on dirt roads if I needed to. I had no Idea that I would end up ridding 20 to 30 miles at a time and love it. The Local bike shop recommend that I get a bike with disc breaks if I had any intent to ride my bike in the winter or spring months here in Colorado. I with with the Secteur disc because I thought it would give me the most flexibility as I was not sure If I would love the sport and stay with it. 6 months latter I really love the sport and I am looking to buy a new road bike in the Spring. However I have a dilemma that I was hoping I could voice here and hopefully get some feed back and suggestions.

I would like to get a Carbon bike with at least 105 components. However I do not want to spend $2000 or more for a carbon frame that is not designed for disc breaks. If the industry is going to disc breaks on road bikes why would I buy a non disc carbon frame now and then have to spend another $2000 or more in a few years when disc breaks are every where?

Any thoughts on this dilemma would be great thanks!

cougie
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Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 22:34 pm

Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby cougie » Wed Nov 06, 2013 15:56 pm

Why would you have to buy a new bike in 2 years time ?

Things change all of the time in cycling - it doesn't mean your bike becomes unusable.

You can get a road bike with disk brakes now if you want to. There aren't a great number as a lot of people are happy with their normal rim brakes.

I suspect until the pro peloton have disc brakes - then discs will be in the minority.

(and you can get a Planet X carbon frame with 105 disc brakes for under £1000 - ok so its a cyclocross bike but it will be 99% as fast as an equivalent priced road bike)

markhewitt1978
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby markhewitt1978 » Wed Nov 06, 2013 16:00 pm

It's far from certain road bikes will go to disc brakes - they probably won't until the pros start racing them and the UCI has kicked the issue into the long grass for now.

In any case, it's pointless waiting around to see what might happen, you said you are going to buy a bike in the Spring, excellent, base your decision on what is available there and then, what may or may not happen in the future is irrelevant.

In any case, don't dismiss rim brakes, they work fine.

Tumba
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Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 20:26 pm

Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby Tumba » Wed Nov 06, 2013 16:03 pm

I really like the disc break idea on a road bike. My current bike has disc breaks and I really like them. I know I want a carbon bike with disc breaks I just don't know if and how long I should wait to get one.

I really like this bike http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bikes/ ... -sora-disc but hate that it only comes with Sora. If it came with 105 I think I would get it!

http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bikes/road/roubaix/roubaix-sl4-sora-disc

Slowbike
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby Slowbike » Wed Nov 06, 2013 16:12 pm

Ah - now, for the winter months you may well be better off with disc brakes - but for the summer months you can go for rim brakes - so in the spring, buy a good carbon bike with rim brakes and keep your Secteur for the winter....
n+1 !!

markhewitt1978
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Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 15:48 pm

Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby markhewitt1978 » Wed Nov 06, 2013 16:22 pm

Slowbike wrote:Ah - now, for the winter months you may well be better off with disc brakes - but for the summer months you can go for rim brakes - so in the spring, buy a good carbon bike with rim brakes and keep your Secteur for the winter....
n+1 !!


And there we have it. OPs issue is solved. Come back in the spring when deciding which bike to buy.

#threadclosed

cougie
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby cougie » Wed Nov 06, 2013 16:29 pm

And we spell it "brakes".

Kajjal
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby Kajjal » Wed Nov 06, 2013 19:29 pm

I would stick with disc brakes if you find they work well for you so far. They work much better than rim brakes especially if you are a heavier rider and have better modulation. I weight 220 lbs as well at over 6ft6 and find the disc brakes on my xc mountain bike are much better than the rim brakes on my road bike, especially in the wet.

The next road bike I have will have disc brakes on for that reason. Just make sure you get the bike you want even if you have to save up a bit longer.

By the way well done on the weight loss and improved fitness :)

solboy10
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby solboy10 » Wed Nov 06, 2013 19:45 pm

markhewitt1978 wrote:
Slowbike wrote:Ah - now, for the winter months you may well be better off with disc brakes - but for the summer months you can go for rim brakes - so in the spring, buy a good carbon bike with rim brakes and keep your Secteur for the winter....
n+1 !!


And there we have it. OPs issue is solved. Come back in the spring when deciding which bike to buy.

#threadclosed


This for me is quite simple. If buying a new Summer Bike = carbon, sexy wheels, rim brakes, if buying a new winter bike = steel, 23mm wide rims with 28mm plus tyres, disc brakes. However having had discs on my old MTBs the difference between hydraulics and cable disc brakes was like night and day so not sure I would want cable disc brakes on a road bike? Hyrdaulics will become common place on road bikes in a few years but until then get a good frame and mid range groupset. My Ultegra rim brakes are excellent.

Tumba
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby Tumba » Wed Nov 06, 2013 20:28 pm

Do you guys think that the current disc breaks equipped bike frames will be able to accommodate any type of disc breaks that may be developed into the future, or is there a possibility that these early disc break frames will be obsolete in the future because advancements in disc break technology wont be able to be mounted on the frame? Or would it say that any disc break frame produced in 2013 or 2014 will be able to accommodate any disc break that will developed say into 2019.

neeb
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby neeb » Wed Nov 06, 2013 20:53 pm

Tumba wrote:Do you guys think that the current disc breaks equipped bike frames will be able to accommodate any type of disc breaks that may be developed into the future, or is there a possibility that these early disc break frames will be obsolete in the future because advancements in disc break technology wont be able to be mounted on the frame? Or would it say that any disc break frame produced in 2013 or 2014 will be able to accommodate any disc break that will developed say into 2019.

There's a lot of talk about road bikes with disk brakes evolving towards a standard with smaller rotors, which will probably need different mountings etc. The standards are not settled yet, so it's highly likely that a disk brake equipped bike you buy now may not be compatible with future standards.

I'd keep the current bike but buy a good, lightweight rim brake equipped bike. Ride the new bike in dry weather, use the old one with the disk brakes in wet weather or for commuting. You'll get used to the rim brakes. A lot of the hatred of rim brakes coming from the MTB fraternity etc is just because it's a slight shock suddenly finding you need to pull a little harder on the levers as opposed to operating them with your little finger. You get used to it, it's no big deal.. ;-)

Al lot depends on the terrain where you are, but to be honest, if you are riding on open country roads with no big hills, you hardly need to brake anyway - why lug around disk brakes?

Kajjal
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby Kajjal » Wed Nov 06, 2013 21:17 pm

neeb wrote:
Tumba wrote:Do you guys think that the current disc breaks equipped bike frames will be able to accommodate any type of disc breaks that may be developed into the future, or is there a possibility that these early disc break frames will be obsolete in the future because advancements in disc break technology wont be able to be mounted on the frame? Or would it say that any disc break frame produced in 2013 or 2014 will be able to accommodate any disc break that will developed say into 2019.

There's a lot of talk about road bikes with disk brakes evolving towards a standard with smaller rotors, which will probably need different mountings etc. The standards are not settled yet, so it's highly likely that a disk brake equipped bike you buy now may not be compatible with future standards.

I'd keep the current bike but buy a good, lightweight rim brake equipped bike. Ride the new bike in dry weather, use the old one with the disk brakes in wet weather or for commuting. You'll get used to the rim brakes. A lot of the hatred of rim brakes coming from the MTB fraternity etc is just because it's a slight shock suddenly finding you need to pull a little harder on the levers as opposed to operating them with your little finger. You get used to it, it's no big deal.. ;-)

Al lot depends on the terrain where you are, but to be honest, if you are riding on open country roads with no big hills, you hardly need to brake anyway - why lug around disk brakes?


Its a personnal preference. I bought my first bike with disc brakes this year an XC MTB. The braking performance is much better than any rim brakes. Less effort, more power and much better modulation. I also bought a new road bike a few months back and in comparison on steep downhills the rim brakes were useless. Even after I upgraded them to a better set they locked up the wheels if needed in the dry but still not as good as disc brakes. In the wet rim brakes are very poor in comparison.

Slowbike
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby Slowbike » Wed Nov 06, 2013 21:57 pm

Kajjal wrote:I would stick with disc brakes if you find they work well for you so far. They work much better than rim brakes especially if you are a heavier rider and have better modulation. I weight 220 lbs as well at over 6ft6 and find the disc brakes on my xc mountain bike are much better than the rim brakes on my road bike, especially in the wet.

The next road bike I have will have disc brakes on for that reason. Just make sure you get the bike you want even if you have to save up a bit longer.

By the way well done on the weight loss and improved fitness :)

On my carbon bike with shimano 105 I can lock the wheels with rim brakes. Not sure discs are going to make that any better.

neeb
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Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2003 19:01 pm

Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby neeb » Wed Nov 06, 2013 22:13 pm

I wonder how much weight affects modulation on rim brakes on steep descents. I've never had a problem with rim brakes in the dry, and I did ride an MTB with hydraulic disks for a few years so I know the difference. In the wet it's a different matter of course, no doubt that disks have a big advantage. I wonder if a graph of modulation range vs. force applied would show a tail-off towards higher forces with rim brakes. Maybe rim brakes become more "grabby" when applied forces are higher. If so, heavier riders would have more issues and would notice the difference more with disk brakes. It could be a big difference too, the braking force needed to slow a 60kg rider will be massively less than the force needed to slow a 100kg rider by the same amount.

thecycleclinic
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby thecycleclinic » Wed Nov 06, 2013 23:33 pm

It is not a dilema at all get what appeals to you. My next road bike (I have several for the fun of it) will be a disc brake bike. Who cares if all road bikes end up that way.

I can lock the wheels on my canti equipeed MTB but I know my disc equiped MTB brakes better under all conditions. By better braking is more controlable. It is amusing to see all the roadies wondering if disc brakes are an improvement they obviously have not been hurtling down a mountain side on an MTB in the wet on canti's or V's wondering if that hairpin coming up will be one if you will survive! I was in that situation one back in 2005 on a wet Novembers day in Wales. When I got back home I took the bike in and the Hope Moni Minis fitted I have to this very day. Still use canti's but to add comedy to the ride.
http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.

Kajjal
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby Kajjal » Thu Nov 07, 2013 17:48 pm

neeb wrote:I wonder how much weight affects modulation on rim brakes on steep descents. I've never had a problem with rim brakes in the dry, and I did ride an MTB with hydraulic disks for a few years so I know the difference. In the wet it's a different matter of course, no doubt that disks have a big advantage. I wonder if a graph of modulation range vs. force applied would show a tail-off towards higher forces with rim brakes. Maybe rim brakes become more "grabby" when applied forces are higher. If so, heavier riders would have more issues and would notice the difference more with disk brakes. It could be a big difference too, the braking force needed to slow a 60kg rider will be massively less than the force needed to slow a 100kg rider by the same amount.


You may well be right as I weight just under 100KG. My road bikes rim brakes are OK in the dry and I don't have any major worries. My MTB disc brakes are alot better wet or dry. If I got my weight down to 60kg (unlikely at 6ft7) then I would guess rim brakes would perform a whole lot better.

Kajjal
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby Kajjal » Thu Nov 07, 2013 17:51 pm

thecycleclinic wrote:It is not a dilema at all get what appeals to you. My next road bike (I have several for the fun of it) will be a disc brake bike. Who cares if all road bikes end up that way.

I can lock the wheels on my canti equipeed MTB but I know my disc equiped MTB brakes better under all conditions. By better braking is more controlable. It is amusing to see all the roadies wondering if disc brakes are an improvement they obviously have not been hurtling down a mountain side on an MTB in the wet on canti's or V's wondering if that hairpin coming up will be one if you will survive! I was in that situation one back in 2005 on a wet Novembers day in Wales. When I got back home I took the bike in and the Hope Moni Minis fitted I have to this very day. Still use canti's but to add comedy to the ride.


I think part of it is a resistance to change and as you suggest once you have been off road down a long , steep, rocky descent you just want brakes that work. On my 1990's GT Outpost the canti rim brakes did little to stop the bike on steep downhills wet or dry.

thecycleclinic
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Re: Road bike disc break dilemma

Postby thecycleclinic » Thu Nov 07, 2013 20:54 pm

The main issue with road bikes with disc brake is the lack of rim and hubs currently if you want to campag or 11 speed shimano. However as Miche are releasing there hubs soon and the DT Swiss 240 and 350 hubs should be able to accept a a road freehub. As carbon rims in 28H drilling are available (I have some and need to order more), that means there are alternatives to the very few road disc brake wheels on the market currently.

They will become more than niche over the year. 29er's started out as niche now they are everywhere.
http://www.thecycleclinic.co.uk -wheel building and other stuff.


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