deda carbon bars cracked (again)

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markyone
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deda carbon bars cracked (again)

Postby markyone » Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:49 am

Brand new deda superleggero carbon bars cracked at 5nm fitting to the deda stem so not f**king happy.
Bought these from wiggle going to see what hey have to say.Well I know what they will say.
Very light bars wafer thin.
Can they be repaired?
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Last edited by markyone on Mon Jun 02, 2014 17:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Grill
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Grill » Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:52 am

No. Next time don't over torque them.
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Bobbinogs » Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:55 am

Why not wait to see what Wiggle have to say? I have always found them to be very reasonable. The crack is in the classic place for overtightening the stem clamp, but if you are certain they have never been used and show no signs of any wear then I reckon Wiggle would be reasonable.

Carbon can be repaired but I am not sure I would want a repaired handlebar...then again I use some alloy Cinelli bars that must be 25 years old and I don't worry about them when I probably should.

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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby markyone » Sat Dec 28, 2013 11:57 am

Grill wrote:No. Next time don't over torque them.

5nm is to tight?
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Bobbinogs » Sat Dec 28, 2013 12:13 pm

markyone wrote:
Grill wrote:No. Next time don't over torque them.

5nm is too tight?


Oh dear! So you did fit them (missed that from your original post) and they are now cracked. Makes it a much harder argument since who is to know exactly how much force was applied. One could understand any supplier taking a "you'll have to try a warranty claim and see how you get on" approach.
Last edited by Bobbinogs on Sat Dec 28, 2013 12:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Grill
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Grill » Sat Dec 28, 2013 12:14 pm

In this case it clearly was as you can see perfectly where the clamp has gone into the carbon. Check manufactuerers specifications and also you should make certain that your torque wrench is in spec.

Still don't know why people buy these things. My alu bars are lighter, stiffer, cheaper and an assload stronger.
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby NapoleonD » Sat Dec 28, 2013 12:36 pm

Manuf specs on deda stems are 6-8nm depending on model
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby sungod » Sat Dec 28, 2013 13:57 pm

bummer, did you tighten the clamp bolts in the correct order and obey the top-bottom equal gap instruction?

tbh even with alloy stems/bars i only tighten until they are secure, typically this is far below the maximum torque
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby markyone » Sat Dec 28, 2013 14:42 pm

sungod wrote:bummer, did you tighten the clamp bolts in the correct order and obey the top-bottom equal gap instruction?

tbh even with alloy stems/bars i only tighten until they are secure, typically this is far below the maximum torque

Yes done all that,i think I might just have to buy again :( cant see wiggle coughing up,oh well.
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Rolf F
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Rolf F » Sat Dec 28, 2013 17:17 pm

Grill wrote:Still don't know why people buy these things. My alu bars are lighter, stiffer, cheaper and an assload stronger.


Really? What alloy bars can you get that weigh less than 180 grams?
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby markyone » Sat Dec 28, 2013 17:20 pm

Rolf F wrote:
Grill wrote:Still don't know why people buy these things. My alu bars are lighter, stiffer, cheaper and an assload stronger.


Really? What alloy bars can you get that weigh less than 180 grams?

That's what I was thinking,i have been looking on line for alloy bars but not found much.
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby mfin » Sat Dec 28, 2013 17:27 pm

5nm can be too tight on some carbon parts. I've always been wary of this and often on 5nm settings and found time and again that when I tighten by 'feel' I am below 5nm.

I rode a Deda Superzero seatpost at 5nm and that is deformed and looks dodgy and I won't be using it again, it will be sawn in half and thrown in the skip.
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Rolf F
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Rolf F » Sat Dec 28, 2013 17:33 pm

markyone wrote:
Rolf F wrote:
Grill wrote:Still don't know why people buy these things. My alu bars are lighter, stiffer, cheaper and an assload stronger.


Really? What alloy bars can you get that weigh less than 180 grams?

That's what I was thinking,i have been looking on line for alloy bars but not found much.


Same here. I just got a set of the same bars so I might end up being cowardly and getting the LBS to fit them to the stem! :oops:

Incidentally, did yours come with any packaging? Mine came from Ribble (which, to be fair, is far cheaper than anywhere else I found - £169 before the Christmas 10% extra) but just in a cardboard box wrapped in bubble wrap with no specs or anything. The Superleggero Stem on the other hand is neatly packed with a sheet full of torque settings in 47 languages.
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Grill » Sat Dec 28, 2013 17:43 pm

Rolf F wrote:
Grill wrote:Still don't know why people buy these things. My alu bars are lighter, stiffer, cheaper and an assload stronger.


Really? What alloy bars can you get that weigh less than 180 grams?


Didn't look at the weight of these. Most carbon bars are 250g+ with a few exceptions (these being one). I have Ritchey ECS Curve bars which come in at 235g which puts most carbon to shame. Bars are no the place to be saving weight at the expense of durability. My Wyndy is under 6kg with those bars and if I really wanted to shave another 50g, I'd strip the paint before going to carbon bars.
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby markyone » Sat Dec 28, 2013 17:47 pm

Rolf F wrote:
markyone wrote:
Rolf F wrote:
Grill wrote:Still don't know why people buy these things. My alu bars are lighter, stiffer, cheaper and an assload stronger.


Really? What alloy bars can you get that weigh less than 180 grams?

That's what I was thinking,i have been looking on line for alloy bars but not found much.


Same here. I just got a set of the same bars so I might end up being cowardly and getting the LBS to fit them to the stem! :oops:

Incidentally, did yours come with any packaging? Mine came from Ribble (which, to be fair, is far cheaper than anywhere else I found - £169 before the Christmas 10% extra) but just in a cardboard box wrapped in bubble wrap with no specs or anything. The Superleggero Stem on the other hand is neatly packed with a sheet full of torque settings in 47 languages.

Same as yourself just bars in a box with bubble wrap very disappointed.
Do you think they are real?
I cant really remember about the stem.
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Rolf F
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Rolf F » Sat Dec 28, 2013 17:56 pm

markyone wrote:Same as yourself just bars in a box with bubble wrap very disappointed.
Do you think they are real?
I cant really remember about the stem.


Oh yes - I'm sure they are real. If I start doubting what the likes of Wiggle and Ribble are selling then I'd be scared to buy anything online! :lol:

TBH, the less packaging the better IMO - I just expected more and some do's and don't s on a product like this are always appreciated.

Grill wrote:
Rolf F wrote:
Grill wrote:Still don't know why people buy these things. My alu bars are lighter, stiffer, cheaper and an assload stronger.


Really? What alloy bars can you get that weigh less than 180 grams?


Didn't look at the weight of these. Most carbon bars are 250g+ with a few exceptions (these being one). I have Ritchey ECS Curve bars which come in at 235g which puts most carbon to shame. Bars are no the place to be saving weight at the expense of durability. My Wyndy is under 6kg with those bars and if I really wanted to shave another 50g, I'd strip the paint before going to carbon bars.


On a personal basis, I weigh 59kg. Therefore any 'super-stiff' bars are likely to be too stiff for me. Furthermore, If I'm putting far less body weight through my bars than a lot of riders do, then I think it is reasonable to suppose that my lightweight carbon bars will be rather less stressed than many folks alloy bars. So if it is worth me worrying about carbon bars then there are an awful lot of complacent heavy folk using alloy bars who probably need to worry a lot more than I do!

Besides, MTBers seem to be happy to use carbon bars and they give their stuff far more stick than we do.
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Grill
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Grill » Sat Dec 28, 2013 17:59 pm

Fair enough. From a vfm standpoint I'd rather put my cash elsewhere.
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby Jon_1976 » Sat Dec 28, 2013 18:42 pm

mfin wrote:5nm can be too tight on some carbon parts. I've always been wary of this and often on 5nm settings and found time and again that when I tighten by 'feel' I am below 5nm.

I rode a Deda Superzero seatpost at 5nm and that is deformed and looks dodgy and I won't be using it again, it will be sawn in half and thrown in the skip.


I can imagine 5nm being able to damage carbon parts. I tightened all the bolts (stem, seaport, etc) with a regular length allen key and just did it by feel. Admittedly this was on an alu bike with alu parts, but I tightened them to the point where (imo) it would be unwise to go further. Never suffered any slippage. At a later date, I bought a Ritchey torqkey and was pretty shocked/surprised that it wanted to tighten the bolts even more before 'clicking' out. Of course, the torqkey could have been way off in terms of calibration but it felt like 5nm was overkill for those bolts.

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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby mfin » Sat Dec 28, 2013 19:04 pm

Jon_1976 wrote:
mfin wrote:5nm can be too tight on some carbon parts. I've always been wary of this and often on 5nm settings and found time and again that when I tighten by 'feel' I am below 5nm.

I rode a Deda Superzero seatpost at 5nm and that is deformed and looks dodgy and I won't be using it again, it will be sawn in half and thrown in the skip.


I can imagine 5nm being able to damage carbon parts. I tightened all the bolts (stem, seaport, etc) with a regular length allen key and just did it by feel. Admittedly this was on an alu bike with alu parts, but I tightened them to the point where (imo) it would be unwise to go further. Never suffered any slippage. At a later date, I bought a Ritchey torqkey and was pretty shocked/surprised that it wanted to tighten the bolts even more before 'clicking' out. Of course, the torqkey could have been way off in terms of calibration but it felt like 5nm was overkill for those bolts.


I completely agree with what you said, I have done the same thing myself...

Then I did an experiment with one of those Torque keys to try to compare it to this BBB torque wrench http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/bbb-torquefix-kit-btl73/rp-prod60766?_$ja=tsid:46412|cgn:BBB+-+Tools|cn:Chain+Reaction-UK-PLA-PLA-All-DT-SE|kw:225299UK_BBB+TorqueFix+Kit+BTL73&gclid=CLPStb_N07sCFQHHtAodnW0Aaw which admittedly is at the lower end of it's range when set to 5nm, and found the Ritchey Torque key was definitely pretty damn close to that BBB one set at 5nm.

(Carbon assembly paste adds a good amount of friction so is worth using)
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Re: deda carbon bars cracked

Postby DKay » Sat Dec 28, 2013 20:17 pm

Jon_1976 wrote:I can imagine 5nm being able to damage carbon parts. I tightened all the bolts (stem, seaport, etc) with a regular length allen key and just did it by feel. Admittedly this was on an alu bike with alu parts, but I tightened them to the point where (imo) it would be unwise to go further. Never suffered any slippage. At a later date, I bought a Ritchey torqkey and was pretty shocked/surprised that it wanted to tighten the bolts even more before 'clicking' out. Of course, the torqkey could have been way off in terms of calibration but it felt like 5nm was overkill for those bolts.


The thing is, the design of the Ritchey Torqkey means that you can't get a big amount of leverage so you don't swing off it like a gorilla and cause damage. That's why it feels like you're putting loads of effort in.


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